Transcript of Imran Khan | Kung fu films, Christopher Nolan, Main Hoon Na & Obsession | The Longest Interview S4
Chalchitra Talks
0:00Hearts of Darkness.0:01>> Hearts of Darkness. It's so good.0:04>> Insanity. That man goes all in. He makes0:08every film like it's the last thing he0:10will do in his life.0:15>> I saw this film, Perfect Days.0:17>> Yeah.0:18>> It absolutely flawed me. Like I it0:21knocked me down onto the floor.0:24How does an actor say so much and do so0:27much without words? From a a craft lens,0:30it is also like the ultimate flex.0:32>> Ultimate flex 100%.0:38Andre Agassi's autobiography. It's0:40called Open. It's incredible what he0:44puts out there. You're like, bro,0:47utterly naked. That's why he's called it0:49open. He's taken out the most vulnerable0:52parts under say and [music] he's put it0:53out. Watching that film for the first0:56time, you go in with this sense of okay,0:59you know, you know what'll happen. It's1:00a boxing movie. It's an underdog boxing1:02movie.1:07[laughter]1:09That movie just I've never rewatched it.1:12Last night I watched Obsession. It's1:14made for no money, but it feels1:16cinematic and it's made by a 25-year-old1:19kid. This is probably my favorite film1:22in the universe.1:25Are you kidding me?1:33[music]1:40>> On films, we do it every day.1:42>> Yeah. every morning before you start1:46then that is how you start the day.1:48>> Is there a maharaj shot that happens in1:50Hollywood? [laughter]1:52>> Not in the same way they they don't put1:55put the religious aspect onto it.1:58>> In our films you have film kamahurat2:00shot and every morning there is a little2:01puja and nar.2:02>> Yes.2:03>> Every morning they don't they don't have2:05that that system. I appreciate that was2:08little uh [gasps and sighs]2:11reverential touches shall we say. Yeah.2:13>> Which one2:15here2:16>> the idea that you touch the touch the2:19stage before you walk in.2:21>> There's one one uh aspect of respect and2:26reverence for the for the craft which I2:28which I like. We also put like these2:30tikas on the camera dudes [laughter]2:33camera tika2:34>> camera tika and it's a thing in India2:36anytime a gadget is coming in2:39laptop it has you give personality to2:43your tech2:44>> and give respect and status2:46>> yeah so welcome to chaletra talk2:50>> thank you2:50>> and I'm so excited for this conversation2:55because2:58bits and pieces internet but have you3:02talked about films hardcore like on the3:05internet?3:06>> Not not really. And for me I can speak3:09endlessly endlessly. I never get bored3:12of it.3:13>> Uh I I can sit down with uh with3:16enthusiasts and we can go on long long3:20long deep dives on on part very3:23particular and very narrow rabbit holes.3:25>> And unlike other some other podcasts3:30>> [laughter]3:31>> Awesome.3:34Good. Extended edition direct director's3:36cut.3:38>> Yeah.3:39>> I was just uh so last week I was sitting3:42with uh with my daughter and for the3:44first time uh I showed her the Lord of3:46the Rings uh trilogy extended edition3:50uh and she absolutely fell in love with3:53it. Somewhere in the middle we had3:56finished two and three. There was some3:58we having some difficulty getting the4:01extended edition.4:06Should we just watch the theatrical cut?4:09>> She stood up with this offense like how4:11dare you?4:12>> Yeah.4:13>> Uh and I was [laughter] rightly so we4:16watched it. She's in love with it. After4:18that she asked me what is the difference4:20between the theatrical and the extended?4:22So I I had to do a Google check. It4:24turns out it is 2 hours 26 minutes4:27length difference from the theatrical4:29editions to the extended.4:31>> That's 2 and 1/2 hours worth of4:33>> across three films.4:34>> Across three films.4:36>> Uh when I told Imara this, she was4:38outraged. She's like, "How dare they how4:41can they cut out so much of the4:42>> Yeah. You know, one of the first like uh4:45directors cut or the extended editions I4:48saw was of the film Apocalypse. now.4:51>> Almost cut with the the French4:54plantation cut.4:55>> Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. And I really liked4:58it. Like I I that film and the5:00documentary of that5:03>> Hearts of Darkness.5:04>> Hearts of Darkness. It's so good.5:07>> It's insanity.5:08>> Yeah.5:09>> Like Copala. And following that, our man5:13has also made Megalopolis and the5:15documentary of the making of5:16Megalopoulos also.5:17>> Oh.5:20or that man goes all in.5:23>> So here you are on one hand is trying to5:25aspire to really do something on the5:27other hand you're not allowed to be5:28pretentious and finally you say I don't5:30care if I'm pretentious or not5:31pretentious or if I've done it or I5:33haven't done it. All I know is that I am5:34going to see this movie.5:36>> Heart and soul and everything he makes5:39every film like it's the last thing he5:40will do in his life.5:42>> Yeah.5:42>> And I I love that. I respect that5:45tremendously. I remember he winning melo5:51and he put out the statement if you can5:52show it to us. He accepted it with grace5:56like it was the worst film of the year.5:58He was awarded this and6:00I want to show it to you and I'm like6:07totally missing6:08>> and again whatever the flaws of6:12Megalopolis may be that it is a flawed6:14film. You find me cruel, selfish, and6:17unfeilling. I am. I work without caring6:20what happens to either of us. So go back6:22to the club.6:24>> Fine, I will.6:27>> The man spent more than 20 years. He he6:30sold his own winery, his his own6:32property.6:33>> Yeah.6:34>> To to to back the making of it.6:36>> But who cares if you die broke if you6:38made something that you think is6:40beautiful?6:41>> Mab conviction and belief. He bet on6:45himself and he's done it again and and6:47again and again. So even if you stumble6:49and fall on that, the conviction that it6:52takes, the uh the the testicular6:55fortitude it takes6:57>> to do something like this, nobody else6:59gamles with their own money like this7:00studios and all these big pictures.7:03>> Absolutely.7:04>> Look studio and they do whatever. This7:07guy's like no selfund and went all the7:10way. I'm thrilled to accept the Razi7:13Award in so many important categories7:15and for the distinctive honor of being7:17nominated as the worst director, worst7:20screenplay, and worst picture of a time7:21when so few have the courage to go7:24against the prevailing trends of7:25contemporary movie making. In this wreck7:28of a world today where art is given7:30scores as if it were a professional7:32wrestling, I chose not to follow the7:35gutless rules laid down by an industry.7:38Gutless rules. [laughter]7:41>> Gutless rules raid down wine industry so7:43terrified of risk that despite the7:46enormous pool of young talent at its7:48disposal may not create pictures that7:50will be relevant and alive 50 years from7:53now. What an honor to stand alongside a7:55great and courageous filmmaker like7:57Jacis. How7:58>> Jacqu Tati7:59>> Jac Tati uh what has Jac Tati made? uh8:03Monkl, Playtime, a bunch of really uh8:07really fascinating French films. I I8:08highly suggest uh anyone check out8:10Playtime.8:12>> It's a this beautiful art film that is8:16also a satire of modern society and and8:19technology. It's it's a sort of film8:20that8:22transcends time. You don't it it doesn't8:24feel like a film an olden days film.8:26It's visually so beautiful and so8:28precise. So many people owe so much to8:30that. You know if you like Wes Anderson8:32check out Jaci those those very8:34intentional frames.8:36>> I have to ask you since like I can also8:38say that Francis Ford Kapola is a very8:40audacious filmmaker.8:42>> When you think of audacity which are8:44some of the filmmakers that come to your8:46mind [sighs]8:50>> Herszog.8:51>> Yeah.8:52>> Uh these just utter utter madmen.8:55>> Madmen. Yeah.8:57uh who would9:00like I say they they they approach each9:02film like it is not only their last film9:04like it is the last thing they will do9:06in their life on this earth.9:09>> Uh I'm I'm amazed by it. I'm so inspired9:14by it. I I don't uh I don't know that I9:17could have half the courage of that9:19>> but it's it's aspirational.9:21>> Yeah. Uh there's this amazing story9:24again of of Copala and of uh Apocalypse.9:28Have you have you read uh Easy Riders9:30Raging Bulls?9:31>> I know of it and I've seen you talk9:33about it. So please tell us. Yeah. Yeah.9:34Yeah.9:35>> Uh so uh it it was talking about the9:39making of Apocalypse uh and their their9:42production schedule went over budget,9:43over schedule,9:45>> everything that could have gone wrong9:46has gone wrong. By the time they wrapped9:49uh principal photography, they've just9:51wrapped shooting. The film is so wildly9:54overbudget uh that Copala has had to uh9:59relinquish all potential profits from10:01the film that he may have gotten were10:03the film successful. Whatever profits10:05were there, he has had to uh give that10:07back to the studio.10:08>> Ugly film ugly film. [laughter]10:11>> So he is not only not in profit, he is10:14>> Yeah.10:15>> already preemptively in debt. Yeah.10:17>> And his first move upon seeing this and10:20deciding, okay, now I have to start10:21editing the film is to commission a team10:24of carpenters, master carpenters to10:26custom build a pinewood editing uh desk10:29so that he can edit10:30>> properly.10:33>> Now like anyone else who just go to the10:35studio, the studio has editing10:36facilities.10:39>> And please also mention the bit where a10:42private jet used to go to.10:44Yeah, that that is possibly why their10:46production went over schedule and over10:48budget. He had uh a private jet while10:51they were on location in the Philippines10:53if I'm not wrong. Uh you know, if I'm10:55wrong, please correct me in the10:56comments. Uh but the they had a a10:59private jet traveling weekly to France11:01to pick up red wine and somewhere along11:04the journey also picking up cocaine. uh11:08where on the journey who can say11:10[laughter] but yeah this this was all11:13part of how the movie was made it's it's11:16amazing it's insane and and and they11:19made a masterpiece somehow11:20>> yeah dude11:21>> a masterpiece11:22>> and you know I have read about this u11:25and seen a few documentaries where I11:28have kind of uh seen there was this11:30hostility between Marlon Brando and11:32Francis Wapola after first godfather11:36itself.11:37>> Hostility between Brando and anyone who11:39ever crossed his path.11:40>> Yeah.11:42>> A very uh difficult guy it seems.11:45>> Yeah. And he demanded shitload of money11:48by the time Apocalypse Now came in.11:51>> Rando famously was difficult with11:54everyone. I think he uh uh had a lot of11:57friction with a lot of his uh11:59collaborators, directors, actors.12:02>> Yeah.12:11But do you think actor or director?12:14Huh? I And I think12:18it is its own very intimate form of of12:21relationship.12:23And as a as a cophile, if you sit and if12:27you spend too much time on IMDb like12:29some of us,12:31>> you start to see patterns.12:32>> Yeah. Okay. Director and cinematographer12:35they tend to uh have long associations.12:38>> Yeah.12:38>> And often an actor uh a director will12:42find an actor with whom they they have12:45great sync and make many films together12:49from Kurosawa and Mun12:52>> right up to the modern era. You know12:53Scorsesei with Dairo for the longest12:55time, Scorsesei with DiCaprio. Now12:58uh there is I think often a tendency for13:02actors and directors to just fall into a13:05sink and you have a creative13:07shortorthhand where you you understand13:10the the other sensibility. But how is a13:12friendship between an actor and director13:14possible when actor is always wanting13:17something from the director13:21since there is a power dynamic? How how13:23are actual friendships possible?13:27because not every actor and every13:29director are the same. They're also13:31individual humans,13:33>> right?13:33>> So now certainly there will be uh some13:35situations where one is only thinking of13:37gain and profit.13:39>> A director is thinking you know uh can I13:42get an actor big enough so that my film13:43gets funding.13:44>> Yeah.13:44>> An actor might be thinking can I get a13:47role in this big director's film. But13:50stepping beyond that as artists, as13:53creative people, the director uh see a13:57director is someone who is collecting a13:59team of artists together.14:01>> Actor is an artist, cinematographer is14:03an artist, production designer is an14:05artist, music composer is an artist and14:08the director is trying to get the best14:10work out of these individual creative14:12people. Uh in a sense like a like a14:15conductor in an orchestra.14:16>> Absolutely. uh give you flute from here14:19and cello from there14:21>> and you and the director has a has a14:24sense of what s they are after and they14:26know okay this this performer will get14:28that sur which I want and which I need14:30so I can rely on them to consistently14:33hit that creative s which I need for my14:36narrative.14:37>> Yeah.14:37>> So also the actor will feel that14:39confidence with the director.14:41>> Yeah. Because an actor is uh creating a14:45moment of emotional vulnerability.14:48If you're doing uh if you're working14:50authentically and honestly14:53uh you are creating a moment in front of14:56public of nakedness, emotional nakedness14:59and vulnerability and you have to have a15:02level of trust in your director15:05in order to to do that. So when that15:08connection hits, when the sync hits15:10between an actor and a director, they're15:12like, "Yeah,15:14yeah."15:15>> Which are some of your favorite actor15:17director duos across films?15:20>> It's Kurosawa, Mun like15:24uh they did I want what was it 15 films15:27together or 14 films some amazing number15:32uh of of films like every year they made15:34a movie together. M15:36>> uh15:38until15:401 year 65 I think they were making15:42Redbeard something has occurred15:45uh and they never worked together again15:48they never spoke.15:49>> Oh15:49>> they were like they had a a a a15:52relationship that was like super super15:55close. They made so many films together.15:58>> Something has happened and it is it is16:00never known.16:01>> They they didn't work together after16:03that. They didn't speak. They both16:05passed individually never disclosing16:07what happened. Uh there was an in there16:09was a documentary on Kurosawa's uh life16:12where his children and Mafun's children16:15both spoke. They're like we we never16:16knew what.16:17>> Oo.16:19>> So it's one of those great mysteries of16:20cinema and what I consider to be one of16:22the all-time great uh actor director16:25partnerships.16:26>> Uh the films that that these guys have16:29uh have gifted to us16:31>> are are miraculous. Can you look for the16:33name of the documentary? Kurosawa16:35documentary.16:36>> Uh I'm no I'm thinking of Mun the last16:39samurai is the name of the documentary.16:40It's not a Kurosawa documentary. It's16:42Mun.16:43>> Okay. So it's on the actor. Yeah. Yeah.16:45Yeah. Yeah. Okay.16:46>> Uh in Kurosawa's biography.16:48>> Yeah.16:49>> He talks about uh uh seeing Meune16:52audition for the first time and he gives16:55uh at at some point uh a journalist had16:59asked him what is it about the Shiro Mun17:01which you which you like? so much17:04>> and he has given the most uh director17:06response.17:08He says see I like me because uh he can17:11deliver in 10 ft of film what other17:13actors take 30 ft.17:16>> They were rolling celluloid.17:18>> How many feet of film? So economy of of17:21your usage of film was a director's uh17:24calling card. Directors would be very17:26proud17:27>> of their film economy. How many cans of17:29film did you did you use to make the17:31film? Are you shooting extra film?17:33Because any film that gets cut and17:34thrown, that's wastage. So directors17:38were very proud of their shooting ratio17:40and of how much film they would use. So17:43they would literally be thinking in feet17:45of film. So he's like the you say saying17:49actor footage17:51[laughter]17:52would give you an emotion in 10 feet.17:55Other actors take 30 ft.17:56>> Wow. I I'll name a few of my favorite18:00duos. the actor director. So one is a18:02current one uh Ethan Hawk and Richard18:04Linkl.18:05>> Uhhuh. Yeah.18:06>> Like they have done so many films18:07together like across last three decades18:10and the latest one being Blue Moon a18:12film I love.18:13>> I've not seen Blue Moon yet.18:14>> I love Blue Moon like and in fact I got18:16the download of the script also. So I18:18keep marking things. I love the script18:20of Blue Moon a lot.18:21>> I would strongly recommend Blue Moon and18:24uh then they did the whole before thing.18:26Boyhood.18:27>> They're always working together. I just18:29love it. Like they're always thinking of18:31each other.18:36>> I love this.18:37>> This is the way.18:37>> This is the way18:39>> with like with with friends where there18:41is that that uh that kind of easy18:43shorthand relationship where you know18:45okay how we can we can do this thing18:47without the baggage and without the18:48stress. This is how one is able to do18:51good uh authentic work subcreative lo18:54and everyone is coming to set hoping18:58that their creative voice will be19:01appreciated extracted and nurtured19:04that's you know ideally that's what what19:05everyone wants. Uh so if you have an19:09environment that is fostering that and19:10supporting that okay I'm sub creative19:12artist you bring your best I bring my19:15best as an actor I'm trying to work with19:17the cinematographer we are not we are19:20not at opposing ends where our work19:23together combined becomes something19:24better19:25>> there's another one I really like werog19:28and clawkins19:29[laughter]19:30>> I think at one point they wanted to kill19:32each other19:33>> at multiple points19:34>> multiple points I think19:35>> dur while making fitzaraldo famously.19:37Yeah.19:38>> Who brought a gun on set? Either of the19:41gun19:42>> uh so Kinsky is the one who was waving19:45weapons around.19:46>> Ah.19:47>> Uh because he19:49by by any account uh of of this man19:52seems to have been a highly volatile19:56uh uh highly problematic person.20:05He was uh roaming around with a weapon.20:09>> Yeah.20:09>> Uh and the story as uh the story goes20:14that20:15uh they were they were shooting20:17somewhere in South America. Mhm.20:19>> Uh and the lo the the the local village20:22folk who were extras in the film,20:25supporting in the film in whatever way20:28had witnessed uh Kinsky's general20:31erratic behavior and and mad behavior20:33and his uh shall shall we say toxic and20:36abusive behavior.20:37>> Yeah.20:39>> Uh and someone along the way uh it seems20:42went up to Herszog and said, "Hey,20:44listen. if you want, we can take him out20:46for a walk in the forest and [laughter]20:49come back without him.20:51>> Crazy.20:52>> And Hzok was like, "No, no, no. I need20:54to finish my film."20:55>> Yeah. [clears throat] Yeah. Yeah. I in20:57fact like the documentary of Fitz Keral21:00Fitzaldo more than the film which is I21:03think Burden of Dreams.21:04>> Yeah. And I love these both these21:06documentaries, Hearts of Darkness and21:08Burden of Dreams. It shows you the mania21:10of making a film. It is utterly21:14unsanitized. It's it's it's a whole21:16different thing.21:17>> It's and it's startling to look at it21:20from uh the lens from a modern lens21:24where the21:26more safe sterile kind of studio form of21:29film making is what is normalized. That21:30is what most of us uh participate in.21:33That's what we witness. That's what we21:34see. Like21:36these people are doing this this21:38completely other insane thing.21:40>> Yeah. Yeah. Hind who is your favorite21:42duo21:45>> in India? I really like what Rau21:49Madulkar had like21:51>> stretch of films because he presented21:53her like no one else and very distinct21:56roles like21:57>> you see Gangila you see Satya you see K22:00like very you see M that's also very22:03different so22:03>> you know yeah Ramu in the '90s was on22:06this glorious run of really pushing the22:10craft pushing the style uh amazing music22:14he was uh uh really nurturing amazing22:17music talent. Uh Sep Cha when he was uh22:22a a young and and new composer22:25all of those films there there was some22:27awesome stuff there.22:28>> So district is one of our like partners22:30on the show the ticketing platform and I22:33have to ask a question which is uh your22:36first movie watching memory.22:40My first memory that uh of of a movie uh22:44is one of the Indiana Jones movies22:48>> and it's22:51long enough ago that I can't be sure22:53which one. So I was born in 83. Raiders22:56came out 81 I think. Uh Temple of Doom22:59was 84 if I'm not wrong.23:01>> Okay.23:02>> 84 85.23:04Uh, so I I can't be sure which one it23:06was, but it was it was an Indiana Jones23:10movie that I was watching on I guess VHS23:13or something at home.23:15>> Uh, and there's something about the the23:19the the fedora leather jacket and whip23:22thing that23:23>> Yeah.23:24>> some firework went off in my head. Uh,23:28and and that has remained in there ever23:30since till today. There is there is one23:32little Indiana Jones kaka in my head uh23:35which which has never fully gone out.23:37>> Uh is it like a film you watched in23:39theater?23:41>> Uh you know theater I uh my recollection23:46of a theatrical film is the original23:48Masters of the Universe.23:50>> Okay. uh it had released uh in India and23:53uh which23:55uh in in a cinema in South Bombay23:57>> and for the entryway they had actually24:00made a replica of Castle Grey Skull of24:02of the opening.24:03>> Those who are uh like oldtime He-Man24:06fans will remember24:08>> uh so I I remember going to see that24:10because He-Man was the biggest thing in24:12in the 80s24:13>> when when when I was a kid.24:16>> He-Man was everything. Then there's a24:18live action He-Man movie. And when we24:21arrived at the theater, the entryway is24:23real Castle Grey Skull. So, however old24:25I was, I must have been 7 8 years old,24:28something like this, maybe maybe less,24:30who knows? 6 7 8. And to to witness that24:34and then to go in and see He-Man in live24:37action, it it it all of this was like24:42>> shortcircuiting in the brain. There's a24:44new He-Man film which came out24:46>> also called Masters of the Universe.24:47I've not seen it. Uh24:49>> how is the response?24:51>> Uh kind of heavily divided. I uh as I24:55understand it, it it didn't do great at24:57the box office.24:57>> Okay.24:58>> Uh and the audience was very divided.25:01>> Uh some people really enjoyed it, some25:03people really didn't like it.25:05>> Uh which is your favorite movie theater25:08in India?25:11probably uh25:14uh which is a it's it's the South Bombay25:17the old school ones.25:19>> EOS. Yeah.25:20>> Yeah. Because they've they've got that25:22old school vibe, you know, it's the art25:24deco thing and it's like standalone.25:27>> Uh there there's there's a romance to25:29it.25:29>> And have you like watched a lot of films25:31at all all of these Regal and like there25:34is there is Regal which are the other25:36ones?25:36>> Liberty Sterling. So when I was in my uh25:41you know in my teenage years all of the25:44cinemas were in South Bombay. There were25:46no cinemas in any other part of the25:47city.25:48>> Yeah.25:48>> Uh it I'm I'm aging myself and dating25:53myself here. But uh25:55>> up until the late ' 90s early 2000s25:59the cinemas were all South Bombay.26:00That's why you have to go to watch26:01movies.26:02>> And South Bombay. How many people have26:04joined Xavier's because of you?26:07[laughter]26:09I it's it's incredible how many people I26:14bump into who tell me this thing saying26:16you know I went to Xavier's because of26:20because of Janu's26:24I never got I I didn't go to Xavier's26:27[laughter] they they invited me Xavier's26:30college invited me uh uh to the to their26:34college festival Malhar they have every26:35year So I guess it was last year. Okay.26:39>> Uh they had invited me as as a guest.26:43>> So I got to meet the faculty and the26:44principal and all of them.26:46>> So I went and I said you know I I feel26:48like I'm honorary alumni even though I26:51didn't actually go here. They'll say I I26:54feel like this is this is my uh26:57>> my alma alma mur.26:59>> Which is your favorite scene from Janu?27:05probably the uh scene where uh27:10Adi and Amit are talking uh Janelia and27:14Pratik.27:16uh we've seen them have this very kind27:19of uh um very combative relationship27:22through the film27:24>> and then late in the film there's this27:26moment there's and it's a tender moment27:29uh where uh Amit kind of opens up and27:33starts telling her27:35>> uh and he's asking her about all of her27:37friends27:39>> and he then stops and says do you27:40remember any of my friends27:43>> and he's like you are always my And then27:46I feel like you didn't have time for me.27:50Like it something about it like it27:51breaks my heart every time. It feels27:54like such a real intimate moment with27:57them. And it's such a sad moment.28:01>> Correct me if I'm wrong, but Ratna ma'am28:03is also there in Janetu the like where28:06she's the mother, right? Yeah.28:09>> And she's always reading and I loved it.28:12I loved all the scenes.28:14posting all the books she was reading in28:17[laughter]28:22which books will she be reading because28:23the uh the the designing and imagining28:27of uh of the character was was very28:31detailed and thought out. It's not just28:34it's not28:36>> Savvatri was a thought out and designed28:38character because it's only by fully28:40understanding who she is28:42>> that uh that you were able to then28:44define J's character.28:46>> Yeah,28:46>> he is raised by her.28:53So you have to define who she is and28:55what her thought is.28:56>> So all of all of the books that showed28:58up on screen were were thought out.29:01>> Yeah. Abas is a literature major. So29:04that's his that's his background29:11like29:13which people would never think of like I29:16would have never guessed Imran is into29:19these kind of films. [laughter]29:21[gasps]29:21>> So my my favorite nerd out rabbit hole29:25is uh classic kung fu cinema.29:29Uh29:31I grew up as a fan of Jackie Chan as29:34many of us did. Uh and that is uh that29:38was my gateway into Asian cinema and29:41into martial arts cinema.29:44>> And then from there my love just kind of29:47grew more and more and I wanted to go29:49deeper and deeper into all of the uh the29:53classic Hong Kong cinema.29:55uh the what is now called the golden age29:59of of kung fu cinema, the Shaw brothers.30:02Uh that whole era has all of these30:06little sub layers. The way today uh30:10comic book movies and you know like the30:12uh the superhero multiverse30:14>> exists and each character has their30:17powers and their all of this stuff.30:20level you can dive into the depths of30:23this kung fu cinema universe because uh30:26the time period that they're depicting30:28they're they're sometimes depicting30:30historic or semihistoric events30:32sometimes they're depicting folk heroes30:33sometimes it's completely made up uh30:36there there's there's cultural layers30:37and there's also all of these layers of30:40which kind of martial art are they30:42practicing30:44say you can watch and think30:49but it's like layers and layers and30:50layers of different styles. Uh30:52>> how many styles of like30:56>> uh I was making this analogy earlier.30:58It's like someone from outside of India31:00just looking at India and saying Indian31:02food31:02>> or Indian language31:04>> by Indian language can be from Malalam31:07to Hanvi to like where all the language31:11or the food can go.31:12>> Yeah.31:13>> That is the diversity of the martial31:15arts films over there. Huh.31:17>> Uh without much understanding da you can31:21look at it and say it's kind of31:23old-fashioned kung fu which doesn't even31:25look like real fighting31:27>> and dismiss it.31:28>> Once you understand the layers of the31:31what the the point of their physical31:33performance is that's when the enjoyment31:35really starts to come in. Uh so I31:39describe it to people as watching ballet31:42rather than watching action an action31:44film. Uh a lot of these classic films if31:47you watch them today and you compare it31:49to say a John Wick31:51>> you would say this is much more31:53realistic fighting31:55that's not even real action.31:56>> Yeah31:57>> that is to misunderstand the point of31:59what they're doing. These guys at that32:02point were all classically trained in32:04classical martial arts. They were not32:06film people. M32:07>> Gordon Louu who is like you know one of32:10the all-time great stars and is sadly32:13not as world famous as other guys you32:15know guys like Bruce Lee Jackie Chan all32:17of them who have you know welld deserved32:19in their fame Gordon Louu also deserves32:21to be known at that level but it's32:24because he was practicing this classical32:26style32:28>> uh so 36 chambers of Shaolin most people32:32have seen uh and we have an idea of32:34Shaolin Yeah. Now you start to break32:38down. You see that there are all these32:39different martial arts styles within32:41China and depending on who the32:44performers are and who the directors32:45are, what their background is, they32:47making films about that.32:48>> Okay.32:50>> Uh so Gordon Louu and uh the director of32:5536 Chamber Lar32:57uh they are quote unquote martial arts33:00brothers.33:02Gordon Louu trained under Lauar Lang's33:04father who was a master who trained33:06under a master under all of these guys33:08are uh descendants or you know Guru33:12Shisha descendants not biological33:14descendants of Wong Feihung33:17>> Wongfi Hung being a very popular33:19character in Chinese folklore33:21>> played by Jackie Chan in uh in a couple33:23of movies in drunken master and some33:27>> uh but that's a whole separate33:28digression33:29>> but these guys are trained in that33:31classical uh Shaolin kung fu style.33:36Uh you might have Jet Le is a is a good33:40example because Jet Le has trained in33:42Tai Chi33:44>> which is completely different uh like uh33:46Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon33:48>> in that the style of martial arts that33:50they show which has a lot of wire fu you33:52know on wires and all of this but that33:54is depicting Tai Chi completely33:57different martial arts style.33:59uh there is this whole34:02broad division within the Chinese34:04martial arts they call the internal and34:06external styles.34:07>> Okay.34:09>> And internal and external have two two34:12kinds of meanings.34:14>> Internal as in internal energy34:16>> and external as in external strength.34:19But also internal from inside China and34:22external from outside. Shaolin kung fu34:25and the Shaolin monks they follow34:27Buddhism. Okay.34:29>> Buddhism traces its origins to India.34:33So the uh the martial arts style that34:36has developed over there. There's this34:37whole other thing which oh god I'm going34:40to super super nerd of rabbit.34:41>> Please please please.34:43>> Uh so all of this is also you know with34:47the caveat that I'm not a uh I I don't34:50have the deepest knowledge of history34:53from watching way too many kung fu films34:55and reading a little on the side. Mot34:58here is the the narrative thread. Uh35:01there is an Indian uh prince called35:04Buddhi Dharma.35:05>> Okay.35:06>> Uh who seeking wisdom, enlightenment, so35:09on goes on a journey, travels, he finds35:12himself in China35:14and it is this Indian prince Bodhi35:17Dharma who has arrived over there and35:19set up the first Shaolin temple and35:22started the origin of Shaolin Kung Fu.35:24So, Shaolin Kung Fu35:28uh allegedly traces it its roots back to35:30India originally.35:32>> So, it is considered an external martial35:35art. But also, their training depends35:37very heavily on strengthening the body35:39like you see in 36 chambers of Shaolin.35:41>> Tai Chi on the other hand uh traces its35:43origins back to Woudan Mountain which is35:46like name called it uh a name dropped in35:49uh35:50Crouching Tiger. That's where that's35:53uh where they are trained. They follow35:56Daoism35:58>> which is a slightly different philosophy36:00>> and their martial arts philosophies are36:02different. The training is different.36:04There's this whole focus on chi which is36:05an internal energy form.36:08>> Uh so that that is the broadest36:11separation. You've got internal energy36:14and you know old Chinese based martial36:16arts, external energy, external force36:18based which is Shaolin. Then there are36:20further further further subdivisions of36:22whether there's physicality, whether36:24there is a weapon involved and then you36:27start to see how they are weaving these36:28narratives into the films of competing36:31styles. Uh snake in the eagle's shadow36:35uh you know uh crane in the I I forget36:40the titles but there's so many of these36:42which are discussing competing uh36:45competing styles. Then you start to36:47watch the choreography and you see, oh,36:50this person is initially performing one36:52style.36:52>> Yeah.36:53>> They will come up against an opponent36:54who has a conflicting style. They will36:56be forced to adapt, to learn and to36:58modify the way they're approaching.36:59>> Yeah.37:00>> Now you start to see this play out37:02within the narratives.37:04>> Uh you watched eight diagram pole37:07fighter.37:07>> Yes.37:08>> I messaged you also after that. So37:14initially when I watched it like it took37:16me a while to get into the aesthetics of37:18it.37:25But after a point of time I was so37:26invested in the whole thing. I didn't37:28care. The artificiality of it like made37:31sense to me37:36>> because it's like ballet.37:38>> Yeah. Yeah.37:39>> Like you're watching opera. Yeah, I love37:41the film and like37:45Buddhism.37:47That film looks at a few a few aspects.37:50It looks at uh an actual historic37:53thread. Uh Gordon Louu plays uh one of37:57the Yang brothers. Now38:00>> again, Chinese history, mythology. Uh38:03there is oh there was a family the Yang38:06family who it says were the finest spear38:11fighters and they had their own specific38:13style of spear fighting that was said to38:14be38:16>> the greatest the finest38:18>> uh and they were warriors and I I guess38:22they were frontier guards something like38:23this they were protecting protecting the38:25kingdom. So this film tells the story of38:27one of those brothers who is betrayed,38:30ambushed, his family is wiped out.38:32>> Yes.38:33>> Uh and seeking vengeance he goes to a38:36Buddhist temple38:38>> is an irony.38:39>> But that's that is the point. He's he it38:41is his journey.38:42>> Yeah.38:43>> He arrives over there wanting to learn38:45uh a more advanced fighting technique.38:48>> Yeah.38:48>> But the monks won't teach it to him38:50because they don't want him to use38:51violence.38:53So over the course of the film we see38:55then he breaks the spear tip off off of38:58his stick.38:59>> Yes.38:59>> So in in Shaolin Kung Fu they don't use39:02spears they use staff they use a stick39:06because they're Buddhists. Uh they they39:08don't want to take life39:10>> but they'll like take away your teeth.39:13>> Yeah. So you to you disarm the enemy.39:16>> Yeah.39:16>> But do not uh but do not kill them. That39:19is the that is the thought. The so is is39:22that39:23>> but like I never imagined39:27like holy it was such39:29>> graphic. Yeah, it was graphic and I39:31wasn't because the film paced you to a39:34level39:36or last you were seeing these teeth39:38getting broken and all and I'm like so39:40there there's one interesting little39:42side uh anecdote to this film which now39:48you know take it with a grain of salt39:49but uh as they39:53was another actor in the film who played39:55uh the other brother the brother who's39:57losing his mind.39:57>> Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. uh Alexander40:00Fushing.40:01>> Okay.40:02>> Uh who was an upcoming star.40:05He uh he died in a car crash40:10while filming was was ongoing mid film40:13mid production.40:17He literally died in a car crash on his40:19way to the studio.40:20>> Are you kidding me?40:23>> His role was half complete. And one day40:26while driving to studio he had a car40:29accident and he died without completing40:32his his role in the film. So they had to40:36alter the script and alter the ending40:38mid-p production.40:40And what uh the buzz around it was that40:44the the team of the the film was so40:47disturbed that you know one of their40:48friends has has passed away. It's kind40:50of that emotion which turned into the40:52blood bath in the film in the climax.40:54That's why it feels like that there's40:56like a40:57>> Yeah. Suddenly like the tonality like40:59goes up a level. Yeah.41:01>> Yeah. So, as I say, take it with a grain41:04of salt, but this actor did pass in in41:07this way and maybe some of that is what41:10is channeled into the film. Now, this is41:12so interesting because I actually41:13thought of this41:19resolution41:21name vanishes is because he died. It's41:24tragic.41:25>> Or I just love the uh words they were41:27using. Seventh brother, fifth brother,41:29sixth brother. Was it the subtitling41:31actually?41:33>> Ah so this as far as I'm able to41:36understand and this I'm I I don't speak41:38the language41:40>> but this is something which is slightly41:42lost in translation.41:44>> Uh where you know in India we would say41:48uh daddy and nani and we understand the41:50difference.41:51>> Yes.41:51>> But in English how do you explain the41:53difference?41:53>> Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So there41:55are words in Hindi that you can't41:58translate into English. And this is what42:00I'm understanding from there when42:01they're saying sixth brother, you know,42:03second brother.42:04>> Second brother.42:05some some phrase must have been there42:07like you you know ba42:10yeah42:15who knows42:16>> and like if I may talking about the dii42:18she was very good-looking like42:19[laughter]42:20>> so you have you have spotted kahui who42:23is a badass amazing star she's in she's42:26in uh dirty ho as well42:28>> yes yes yes42:29>> so she is uh actually you know at at a42:32at a time where the industry She was uh42:36more male ccentric. She was uh kind of a42:40a pathbreaker female action star.42:43>> Uh also high high level uh kung fu42:48professional. She was in a bunch of42:49films by Laar Lang and continues to act42:52to this day.42:53>> Oh wow.42:53>> Uh she's in some she's in a couple of42:55great films with Donn Yen. Uh42:58Warrior from 2011.43:01uh is no sorry not Warrior43:04from 2011 with uh Donny Yen one I'll43:08recommend very highly43:09>> okay43:11>> uh which actually has uh Kawawaii in it43:14and also has Jimmy Yang43:16>> okay43:17>> uh both of whom are together in Dirty Ho43:20with Gordon43:20>> yeah yeah tell me something about Gordon43:23Louu and how did they get him for Chandi43:27Chalk to China [laughter]43:31I haven't asked. I should ask because43:33I'm friendly with Nikil.43:34>> Yeah.43:35>> Uh but my guess and my assumption is43:39that Nikil himself would have been a fan43:42of of the Kung Fu films. He he he would43:44have seen at least a few and and known43:47who Gordon Louu is because43:51>> uh between Nikil uh Akshai Kumar is also43:56uh I mean he himself is a martial43:58artist.44:00uh and is a fan of of the classic44:03martial arts films. This I this I do44:05know about him. Uh so between Nikil and44:08Akshai Kumar they will have they will44:11have certainly had a clear sense of who44:14Gordon Lew is and how how big a deal he44:16is.44:17>> So I have a bunch of stupid questions.44:19One is martial arts kung fu is a form44:22right?44:22>> N kung fu is a very very very very very44:25very broad catch all term. Kung fu is44:28not a subset of martial arts.44:30>> No, the martial arts are subset of kung44:32fu. So kung fu uh44:36loosely the phrase translates to like44:40mastery from hard labor. Something like44:44this44:46master. So you will see a theme in a lot44:49of these films that everything is kung44:51fu.44:52We're doing laundry.44:55[laughter]44:56Twist it. Twist it. Get the water be44:58kung fu cooking chopping this that that45:00you be kung fu. So kung fu45:04broadly is like mastery of of craft like45:07your craft is so good.45:09>> Okay. If you become a master master45:12cooking45:14this their films and so on then you can45:17from that sidestep into fighting.45:21They you you they they would show us45:22this in the films in the old Karate Kid45:24film.45:25>> Yeah. wax on, wax off. Take the jacket45:27on, put the jacket off. You keep doing45:28this one act and then that translates45:30into the fight.45:33>> So, kung fu is a very broad term45:36referring to mastery and skill. Now,45:39within that, which specific martial art45:41are you following? Are you there? There45:42is hungar, there is tai chi, there is45:45bhagwa, there is chingi, you know there45:48there's all of there's different styles45:51>> depending on45:53uh where you trained, who your master,45:55what your region or all of this. So that45:58is where the interesting layers come in.46:05If you are doing it with a high degree46:07of precision,46:09>> you watch uh so this is a recurring46:13common theme in Chinese kung fu films.46:16>> You will see them translate the art this46:19way, that way in um in kung fu hustle.46:23>> They live in this basti. And these kung46:25fu masters are disguised as local guys.46:28One guy's working as a tailor. One guy46:30is working as as a laborer. he's46:32carrying but he is using his kung fu in46:34that as well. The ethos is this that you46:38can by developing mastery over whatever46:41your discipline is but you're doing it46:44with absolute flare and precision at an46:47elevated skill level.46:56You see it happen. You have see it46:57happen in the Rajnikant films also. You47:00see it happen in so many different kind47:02of genres. So47:06inspired.47:07>> Yeah. And it also it's it's cinema you47:12are trying to uh it's it's an47:14audiovisisual medium. So even for an47:18audience who may not have the full47:20understanding.47:21>> Huh.47:21>> You are trying to get their attention47:24there. H.47:25>> So if you're doing three moves, 1 2 3,47:29>> it may be so fast that the viewer might47:32not fully catch it.47:33>> You're you want to underline it and47:35emphasize it with the sound effect.47:36>> So if someone thinks they have seen John47:39Wick and they think it's the greatest47:41action film they have ever seen, what47:43would you say, bro? I want you to see47:45these five more films to understand what47:47is good action.47:48>> Huh? Well, good action47:51>> like five films you would recommend to47:52someone who would really love John Wick47:55past.47:57>> So John Wick uh is more of a stunt48:02showcase shall shall we say48:04>> but48:06huh but it is more about communicating48:10the feel of it.48:12>> Okay. classical action films uh and and48:15films with trained artists Jet Le,48:18Jackie Chan, Donn Yen, Bruce Lee.48:22>> Over there you are you are wanting to48:25showcase the physical abilities of a48:28highly skilled practitioner48:31within these films. Not to uh not to48:34lessen the training or the or the skill48:35of you know Kanu Reeves and all of these48:37guys.48:38>> Yeah. But their level is they are highly48:42they have trained a lot for this. It is48:44not it is not a bachanka48:48trained from childhood so that you are48:50madly proficient in this one thing. With48:52those they will there will be fewer48:54cuts. There will be wider shots. You48:56want to showcase the precision and the48:59and the craft that this person is49:01displaying. So if you have two two very49:04very skilled performers fighting, you'll49:06keep the camera wide and you won't cut.49:08So you can see what they're doing and49:10you will hold it longer. Uh in in uh in49:15action choreography,49:17uh we we uh we go with beats. Each49:20movement is a beat. Punch, punch, kick,49:24duck, step, turn, so on, so forth. So49:28it's 1 2 3 4. Each one is a is a beat. A49:33handy guide is to try and count how many49:36beats before we cut. A modern Hollywood49:39film, John Wake or any of them,49:42>> you are highly unlikely to have more49:45than three beats49:47>> before a cut. In these films, if you're49:49watching uh Bruce Lee or if you're49:51watching Gordon Lou,49:52>> they'll go 8 10 12 14 beats49:55>> before a cut49:56>> in a wide shot with two actors. 1 2 3 449:595 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14.50:07>> That is difficult.50:09>> Like the old boy scene.50:10>> Yeah.50:11>> Yeah.50:11>> It's more difficult. Cuts make it easier50:14and you can conceal uh you can conceal a50:18lot more.50:19>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. particularly the50:21points of impact.50:24When you're uh when you're shooting over50:26shoulder, you can conceal the point of50:28impact and you're like, "Okay, fine. The50:30fist is lining up there. Must have hit."50:33If you're in a side shot, you can't50:35conceal the impact uh quite as well. It50:38requires greater skill on the part of50:40the performer of both performers to50:42either make it appear that you're50:44contacting. Sometimes they actually do50:46contact, but it's a controlled contact.50:50Sometimes it's not so controlled and you50:51can tell.50:52>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.50:53>> But that's where you start to see oh the50:56here is how difficult this physical50:58performances.51:01>> Uh someone who is uh like I I just51:05parallel shout out51:08in the modern era massively massively51:11underrated uh uh underrated actor uh51:15Scott Atkins.51:16Uh Scott Atkins is, you know, kind of51:20the equivalent of the 80s, uh, you know,51:24Van Vanam and, uh, all of the films that51:29those guys were making.51:30>> Okay.51:30>> So, Scott Atkins is an amazing martial51:33artist, highly skilled physical51:35performer.51:37uh in his films the action and the stunt51:40work are what kind of take the four51:43>> generally very lowbudget films and you51:45can tell that they're low budget but the51:47stunt work and the action is like four51:50levels higher than what mainstream51:52Hollywood is putting out.51:54>> It's it's far more visceral, far more51:56powerful.51:57>> And once again, you can see these guys52:00are are doing the thing. It's in a wide52:02shot. They're holding the uh the scene52:05like going through the through the52:07beats, jumping, kicking, blocking,52:09hitting, falling.52:11How many times can you do a spinning52:13back kick before your hamstrings start52:15to get52:15>> Yeah.52:16>> You you you that's what you feel when52:18you're watching these performers.52:20>> So in a way action dire a good action52:22director is also a choreog52:24choreographer, right?52:25>> You have to be a choreographer.52:26>> Yeah. You have to understand how this52:29movement will look in the frame and then52:30you also have to set your frame in such52:33a way that we can see the entirety of52:36the movement. That's what Lokar Lang was52:39a master of52:41uh blocking the action which means how52:44is it moving how is the choreography and52:47where do I put my camera so that the52:48choreography looks the most beautiful52:51and you see all of the movement. In52:53recent times, is there a good action52:56scene that you have seen in films that52:58you think often of?53:00>> In recent years, uh there is an action53:03choreographer who I've been following a53:05lot of this guy Kenji Tanigaki.53:08>> Okay.53:09>> Uh53:10I started following this guy's work53:13because I was uh watching so there's53:15this Japanese series of films called53:18Ruroni Kenshin.53:19>> Okay.53:20>> Uh there are five films in total. M53:23>> uh which I highly highly highly53:26recommend.53:26>> Okay.53:27>> I uh my my the the elevator pitch is53:30it's the intersection between Kurosawa53:33and the Marvel Cinematic Universe.53:35>> Ah53:37>> uh these films have53:41without question the best sword53:44choreography that I have seen and some53:46of the most amazing fight choreography.53:50So the films are amazing. Uh the fight53:54choreographer uh this Kenji Tanigaki uh53:57guy who start actually started off with53:58Don Yen. So he's kind of Don Yen's54:00proteége. Now he is uh stepped out and54:04he's making his own films. He just made54:06a film which might be in cinemas right54:08now called the furious.54:10>> Okay.54:10>> Uh it got a very limited release in54:12India. I haven't seen the film yet but54:14this guy is doing amazing work. Would54:16you open YouTube54:18>> and look for uh Kenshin versus Sojiro? S54:24O J I O.54:26>> Yes.54:26>> So this is the guy Kenshin.54:28>> Okay.54:29>> He is a guy who54:31uh during the war was an assassin for54:34the government.54:35>> Okay.54:36>> Killed so many people54:38>> with such ferocity that he is nicknamed54:41the mansllayer. And it weighs on him so54:44much that after the war ends he uh lays54:47down his sword and says he will never54:49kill again. So he carries what is called54:52a sakabato a back blade katana where the54:56the edge that faces the enemy is blunt54:59and the side that faces him is sharp.55:01>> Wo.55:02>> So it can never cut but if it goes back55:05>> so every time he pulls it out it is55:07dangerous to him but he cannot take a55:10life.55:11This is who the character is. So at the55:15near the end of the first film, he comes55:19up against an adversary, which is what55:21we're55:32>> No cuts. Go back again and count how55:35many phrases before the cut.55:36>> Yeah.55:38>> So too short. You can see both of them.55:401 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 10 11 Yes.56:03Whoa.56:15>> You see how they move?56:16>> Yeah.56:17>> The choreography and the movement,56:19they're not cutting out of it. They're56:20that wide. And both of these guys are56:22moving so fast within that.56:24>> Yeah. So you you really get a sense of56:26the speed that they are moving fast not56:29that the cutting is happening fast.56:31>> I want to show you a scene which I56:33really like. I think you might have56:35already seen it but I want you to review56:38this scene for me like an action scene56:40from a very famous Hollywood film. For56:41me it's one of the best action scenes56:43from Hollywood. Can you please play?56:46>> Oh wait. This is one of the Born movies,56:48isn't it?56:48>> Yes.56:54The masters of shaky cam.56:55>> Yeah. Paul Greengrass.57:00>> 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 10 cuts57:04>> for the jump.57:05>> So his jump across the balcony. Can you57:07Can you jump back? How many cuts for the57:10jump?57:11>> 1 2 3 4 5 6 7. Yeah.57:16>> For the jump. Imagine if you had the57:18whole jump in a single cut.57:20>> Yeah.57:20>> In a single shot. Go back to the jump57:22again. There's the there's the most57:25beautiful one in it where it's following57:27him.57:28>> Yeah.57:28>> Have you seen how they did this?57:30>> How?57:31>> It's very famous. The making of uh so57:33the stunt man has actually done the jump57:35across.57:35>> Okay.57:36>> There's a cameraman on a cable who has57:38run and jumped off the building with57:39him.57:40>> Ah.57:40>> So this guy does the jump all the way.57:42The cameraman has done the jump across57:43the building and then fallen in between57:45the buildings.57:46>> Oh,57:47>> that's how they've got that shot.57:48There's one shot where you can see just57:50as he's flying towards it, it's after57:53the foot insert57:57>> the hand to hand.57:58>> This guy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The57:59hand to hand to hand.58:00>> So this guy is a great fighter. His name58:02is uh58:05this one.58:06>> Yeah. That's the jump that they held58:13on.58:16One, one, one, one. Punch. One, one,58:22[clears throat] one, one, one.58:42>> [clears throat]58:48>> That's the only move that they held58:49completed the movement because the guy58:51can actually do it.58:52>> You can pause. So, tell me about this58:54guy. Yeah.58:54>> Uh I've forgotten his name right now,58:57but he is a uh he's he's a he's a59:00quality fighter and stunt man. He's a59:02guy who's done a bunch of uh he's in a59:05few films with Scott Atkins as well,59:07>> as as I recall.59:08>> Okay. So [snorts] if you if you start to59:11really watch, you know, all the action59:14films and you then you go to the B B59:16list and the C list and all of these,59:18>> a lot of faces start to show up and then59:20you start to say you you know who this59:22guy is.59:22>> Yeah.59:23>> Uh so Scott Atkins uh you know has lots59:28of fans out there uh and all the people59:31who are like you know fans of classic59:33action cinema. Scott Atkins he showed up59:36in the last John Wick movie in fact. Oh,59:38>> in in a fat suit. He's this fat Russian59:41guy with like teeth and like a and uh59:43Keanu kills him in a nightclub.59:46>> So, but like the scene we just saw, like59:48where would you rate it in comparison to59:51the action scenes?59:52>> So, at the time that these films came59:54out, the Born films,59:55>> yeah,59:56>> uh they were doing this amazing thing of59:58shooting all of the stuff live on1:00:00location1:00:02uh and handheld. So, it had this1:00:04grounded, gritty realism to it. Yes.1:00:08>> So, it's very viscerally effective.1:00:11Uh, but it's a little more1:00:14craft dependent. Uh, and it's not the1:00:17greatest showcase of the uh the the of1:00:21the performers physical abilities. It's1:00:24effective storytelling and effective1:00:26action communication. It's not the1:00:28greatest showcase for these people's1:00:30physicality.1:00:31>> Interesting. So it's effective film1:00:33making per se but not necessarily1:00:35effective action.1:00:37>> It's effective action. It's not great1:00:40showcase of individual performer talent.1:00:44>> So if you had uh now within that in that1:00:47film the stunt man who's play who's1:00:49playing the villain1:00:50>> is the guy who has greater physical1:00:52capability than1:00:53>> Matt Damon.1:00:54>> Yeah.1:00:56Now, with respect to all of his training1:00:58and all of the prep that he puts in for1:01:01uh to play Bourne, his ability is not1:01:04going to be at the same level as someone1:01:05who's been a fighter for his uh for much1:01:08of his life.1:01:08>> Yeah.1:01:09>> If that guy were the star, they would1:01:11have wider shots.1:01:12>> Yeah.1:01:13>> So, your shots will depend on the1:01:15ability of your performer. When you're1:01:17in Hong Kong and you're shooting a fight1:01:20scene with Donn Yen,1:01:21>> you will do fewer cuts.1:01:23>> You'll keep your camera wide because1:01:24it's Don Yen. and he can do the thing.1:01:26>> So like Hong Kong1:01:31they I think1:01:39background and then they become actors.1:01:42Donny Yen, uh Jet Lee, a lot of these1:01:45guys they started training in martial1:01:48arts from the time they were children, 41:01:50years old, 5 years old. They competed in1:01:52tournaments. uh they they competed at1:01:54national and international scale as1:01:56martial arts professionals. M1:02:02>> uh a lot of other actors today will have1:02:06fight training, stunt training1:02:08>> but not bachan say classical woou1:02:10training and there is one slight line of1:02:13difference that you can that you can see1:02:15in that there is the older generation1:02:17>> Gordon Louu uh Bruce Lee1:02:21uh moving up to Jetley uh Jetly Donny1:02:25Yen these guys who are actually trained1:02:28in the old style. Uh Jackie Chan, as an1:02:33example, and I say this with with no1:02:35disrespect and no shade, Jackie Chan's1:02:38background is in opera. So, he's trained1:02:41as a physical performer. He's a1:02:43masterful physical performer, but he's1:02:46not trained in a specific martial art.1:02:48He can learn choreography and pick up1:02:50choreography. He's got amazing1:02:51physicality. And over the years, you1:02:54make him do kung fu, he'll do kung fu.1:02:55You make him do Tai Chi, he'll do Tai1:02:56Chi. But he doesn't have that martial1:02:59arts original base. Jetley started his1:03:03life as a martial artist, not as a an1:03:05opera performer.1:03:07>> Which is your favorite boxing movie?1:03:12>> I've never been thrilled with boxing,1:03:16the depiction of it. So, probably Rocky1:03:19because it's1:03:20>> Yeah. One1:03:21>> a box. Yeah. Because it's a boxing1:03:22movie, but it's like a real real real1:03:24movie. The boxing part for me somehow1:03:28watching boxing as a sport within the1:03:30film never got as exciting as uh the1:03:33other sparring.1:03:34>> Is it because you have so much knowledge1:03:37about like the other art forms?1:03:39>> Yeah. So then I'm like punching punching1:03:41punching punching.1:03:42>> And uh the Rocky films while they're1:03:45iconic boxing films,1:03:47>> the boxing choreography is not very1:03:48good. It's very filmy boxing. You know,1:03:51if you if you watch it from a sport1:03:53perspective,1:03:55it's very stylized and filmy boxing.1:03:57It's not technical boxing. So I I I1:04:01never got too enthused by by boxing1:04:04films.1:04:07I yeah I've watched all of the Rocky1:04:08films. I watched all of the Creed films.1:04:11They're generally a lot of these are1:04:13really good films. The Creed films I1:04:14really enjoyed. But the boxing part of1:04:17it you're like1:04:21>> my favorite boxing film has only a1:04:24little to do with boxing called1:04:25Milliondollar Baby.1:04:26>> Million.1:04:27>> How is that your favorite film? That's a1:04:29depressing. It it's such a1:04:33>> like really you know1:04:34>> I I have tears in my eyes after seeing1:04:37it. Yeah.1:04:37>> Watching that film for the first time I1:04:40really I swear to God I you go in with1:04:43this sense of okay you know you know1:04:45what will happen. It's a boxing movie.1:04:47It's an underdog boxing movie.1:04:52[laughter]1:04:53[panting]1:04:54>> Oh1:04:54>> That movie just h I've never rewatched1:04:57it. I love the films where like uh the1:05:02genre shifting films where the genre1:05:04shifts in the middle of the movie. So1:05:05Milliondoll Baby is for me at the top of1:05:08the list of them.1:05:09>> You go in expecting a certain kind of1:05:11movie and then you're like film wasn't1:05:13about that at all.1:05:14>> So I love and because that's why I also1:05:16try to not watch trailers so that I can1:05:19go in like completely blind and then1:05:21like I can see this mix of genres1:05:23happening between the films.1:05:25>> Yeah. So1:05:29kung fu means kung fu panda. [laughter]1:05:31They are in for a treat while watching1:05:33this. Which is your favorite kung fu1:05:36panda?1:05:36>> I've only seen the first one actually.1:05:39>> I never watched any of the other ones.1:05:40>> You were like this is so bad. Like keep1:05:42me away from this.1:05:44>> This [clears throat] is disrespectful.1:05:46>> It's not disrespectful actually. Uh if1:05:50it's made with a lot of love and1:05:51reverence.1:05:53uh and every so often you can see it.1:05:55When you watch a film, you're like,1:05:56"Huh, this person really enjoyed it.1:05:59I'll tell you a film recently which1:06:02really uh uh exceeded my expectations."1:06:06It's not that recent also. Uh Shangi and1:06:09the Legend of the 10 rings.1:06:10>> Okay. It's it's a Marvel film which kind1:06:14of came and went and uh didn't uh1:06:20didn't become much of a big thing. But1:06:23for me watching the film I could make1:06:26out that the director is a super kung fu1:06:30uh nerd.1:06:32The layering within that he's taken the1:06:35structure and the pattern of classic1:06:36kung fu films. Uh there's so there is a1:06:39classical narrative actually that he's1:06:41woven into this. Here again we go back1:06:43to Gordon Louu.1:06:45>> Uh1:06:47Gordon Louu in the Kill Bill films plays1:06:49a character called Pyime.1:06:51>> Pyime is a popular character within kung1:06:53fu folklore. Uh generally portrayed as a1:06:55villain because he is seen he is1:06:57portrayed as the guy who betrayed the1:06:59Shaolin temple and got the Shaolin1:07:01temple burned down. So Shaolin within1:07:04the Shaolin group Pimeme is like very1:07:07great villain and he's frequently shown1:07:10as the antagonist in films. uh1:07:13executioners from Shaolin and uh1:07:17another one with uh the name is forget1:07:20is I'm losing the name right now but1:07:23there are two films that tell the story1:07:25motor the story is that1:07:28the temple is burned down uh a bunch of1:07:32Shaolin masters are killed Pime is1:07:34responsible and one of the disciples1:07:36like you killed my masterlonga1:07:40>> and he goes to fight uh Pimeme learning1:07:43uh using the style that his master had1:07:45taught him1:07:47>> uh which was uh you know like a closed1:07:49fist style tiger claw and he approaches1:07:52him and every time he he tries to fight1:07:54him he gets defeated. M1:07:57>> uh and after being defeated a few times1:08:01he then starts to learn and again the1:08:04stories are different in one version1:08:05it's from a sister one version is from a1:08:07mother from but he learns crane style1:08:10which is an open palm style and a little1:08:13genderism male style kung fu female1:08:15style kung fu he learns crane style the1:08:19female style and by combining the two of1:08:22them he is able to defeat pime This is a1:08:26common pattern of of story that that1:08:29they would tell there. It's the same1:08:31thread that they follow in Shangi.1:08:34Shangi is uh is trained by his u by his1:08:38father1:08:39>> in a closedfist style1:08:43and act in the middle act of the film1:08:45his mother has passed away. He meets uh1:08:49another mentor figure his mother's1:08:51sister played by Michelle Yo. Okay. like1:08:53awesome badass uh kung fu hero and one1:08:55of my all-time favorites.1:08:57>> Shout out Michelle Yo.1:09:00>> Uh he meets Michelle Yo who starts to1:09:02teach him open palm style. He combines1:09:05the two styles and that is how he1:09:07defeats the villain at the end of the1:09:08film. So even in Shangi he he is used so1:09:13you you see the choreography style1:09:15change. You see him learn the new style1:09:17and that the that journey of the hero1:09:19who knows his father's style of fighting1:09:23and is unable to defeat and then learns1:09:26the other style combines the two1:09:28masculine feminine imbalance.1:09:30>> Wow.1:09:30>> And defeats the villain. So you see so1:09:33watching that I like oh this guy has1:09:35taken the thread and just also as it1:09:38happens on an aside he's cast one actor1:09:42who you can only cast if you're an1:09:44oldtime kung fu fanatic uh uh actor1:09:48called Yuan Wah oldtime and in all the1:09:52kung fu films you'd show up as a second1:09:53third you know somewhere in the one of1:09:55the fighters he's got him as this one1:09:58side character in Shangji1:10:00>> the only reason you cast that is like as1:10:02a as a call back.1:10:05>> So the director is a is a kung fu fan1:10:08and he's put all of it into into Shangi.1:10:11>> For a Marvel comic book movie1:10:14>> made in Hollywood, it has surprisingly1:10:16good kung fu.1:10:17>> Have you ever like tried to learn the1:10:19art form yourself?1:10:21>> No.1:10:23My by the time I started to get1:10:25interested in martial arts, I was1:10:26already into well into my teens. So here1:10:29and there at some point I joined a1:10:30karate class did a thing I never1:10:33followed it with any kind of significant1:10:35discipline1:10:36>> again like I'm trying to understand very1:10:38different kinds of martial arts so one1:10:39is also mixed martial arts which is a1:10:42completely different thing or kushi like1:10:45the wrestling kushi it has nothing to do1:10:47with any of this1:10:49>> uh huh kushi is our Indian style of1:10:53wrestling1:10:54>> which1:10:56if you start to to consider consider it.1:10:59Uh it is based on grappling which1:11:03>> huh which is you're holding a person and1:11:07if you consider a realistic fighting1:11:09scenario where people get into a1:11:11conflict1:11:12realistically you're not going to be1:11:14throwing kicks and punching like that.1:11:16What happens is at some point people end1:11:18up on the floor and you're1:11:19>> Yeah.1:11:21>> That is grappling. That is wrestling.1:11:24If you have some level of of knowledge,1:11:27it will help. Uh people who are fans of1:11:30MMA will know about BJJ, Brazilian1:11:33jiu-jitsu,1:11:35>> uh which is a style of ground fighting1:11:36and grapplings. Uh it's a lot of what1:11:38Keanu does in uh John Wick.1:11:40>> Okay.1:11:41>> Uh very highly practical and functional1:11:44fighting style.1:11:46>> The thing is MMA has developed in recent1:11:50years.1:11:51>> Yes. with the idea of combining1:11:54disciplines. There may be one good1:11:56technique in one style of fighting, one1:11:58good technique in another mixed martial1:12:01arts1:12:01>> to form kind of a holistic functional1:12:04fighting system.1:12:06>> Arguably1:12:08uh the the originator of all of this is1:12:11Bruce Lee. Arguably,1:12:12>> arguably1:12:14>> uh because he started his life training1:12:18in classical wing chun1:12:21uh which is a classical style but he1:12:25himself somewhere started to become1:12:26disenchanted with that and feel that it1:12:29was more showy and more about the form1:12:33>> uh than about functional fighting.1:12:36>> He was the one who was starting to1:12:37question it and say this is not1:12:38practical in a street fight. I can't use1:12:41Wing Chun.1:12:41>> If it is a sport now, now you're talking1:12:43about something else. You have1:12:44regulations, you have rules. But when1:12:46you're talking about fighting as it is1:12:50>> with no rules, real fighting,1:12:51>> well then baby, you better train every1:12:53part of your body.1:12:54>> So for himself, he started to develop1:12:57his own fighting system which he called1:12:58Jit Kundo. Uh the way of the1:13:01intercepting fist.1:13:03>> Okay. Uh so1:13:06generally he is credited as being the1:13:09first person to start combining1:13:11classical martial arts and evolving them1:13:14with an aim to practical street1:13:16fighting.1:13:17>> Tell me let's talk about some of the1:13:19biggies of like Hollywood like uh uh1:13:23which is your favorite Tom Cruz film?1:13:26>> I've loved what he's been doing with the1:13:28uh with the MI franchise, you know,1:13:30narratively uneven.1:13:34uh one one will concede that1:13:38>> certainly narratively uneven but their1:13:39set pieces are just gorgeous.1:13:43>> Uh Fallout remains a high point for me1:13:46>> uh for the backtoback Paris chase1:13:50sequences1:13:52>> uh on the bike and then in the car.1:13:56>> He's uh done this entire chase sequence1:13:59on on the bike and then followed up with1:14:01the chase sequence. He's driving around1:14:03uh an old BMW 5 series.1:14:06>> 3 series. Which one is it? Someone tell1:14:09me.1:14:09>> Okay.1:14:10>> Uh that that whole Paris uh driving1:14:14thing is just1:14:16beautiful.1:14:18So yeah, probably Fallout because1:14:22he's done great stuff before as well,1:14:25but it's it's only once he started uh1:14:27producing the Mission Impossible films1:14:30where he had the control that he could1:14:32really shape the action sequences. Prior1:14:35to that, it is dependent on the director1:14:37and some are amazing. Uh, Days of1:14:40Thunder, very uh under underrated film.1:14:44Shout Listen, Tony Scott, shout out1:14:46under underrated director like that1:14:48man's style. That man's style.1:14:51>> Days of Thunder.1:14:53>> Yeah.1:14:54>> Absolutely just gorgeous film to look1:14:56at.1:14:57>> I think uh in the recent years the two1:14:59great theater experiences I think I've1:15:01had a uh Top Gun Maverick and F1. I've1:15:07just been very fascinated by everything1:15:08Tom Cruz and Brad Pit have been doing1:15:10over the years because wide shut eyes1:15:14wide shut1:15:17everyone is like [snorts]1:15:19documentary.1:15:20>> Yeah. So very very interesting choices1:15:24he has had and I feel the same for1:15:26Bradpit also like a very underrated film1:15:29of Bradpit for me is Troy1:15:32>> and Troy has a action scene ultimatum I1:15:36would have shown you1:15:37>> Hector Hector versus Achilles fight.1:15:40Yeah,1:15:41>> that is such a great action scene.1:15:43>> Top choreography. Yeah.1:15:44>> Hannah.1:15:44>> Yeah.1:15:45>> Which are some like other action films1:15:47across like uh uh genres that you really1:15:51like?1:15:52>> Uh so big recommendation uh is the1:15:55Ruroni Kenshin uh series for all you1:15:58guys anyone out there watching P film1:16:01and it's very confusing to figure out1:16:02the the chronological order.1:16:04>> Okay.1:16:04>> Uh because of how they made them. So1:16:07there's origins which is the first one.1:16:09>> Okay.1:16:10Two and three they made as a they made1:16:12together. So two and three are go1:16:14together.1:16:16>> Uh then comes part four which is the1:16:19final.1:16:20>> Then comes part five which is called the1:16:22beginning which is actually a prequel.1:16:24They're all on Netflix by the way.1:16:26>> This whole franchise dive into this1:16:28franchise. Five films of amazing uh1:16:33action choreography1:16:35uh larger than life storytelling. It's1:16:37it it scratches the comic book age. It's1:16:40like absolute absolute peak, you know,1:16:42early 2000s.1:16:45Uh there was there was a lot of good1:16:46stuff happening.1:16:49So the films will be uneven. Another1:16:51really uh film that I really enjoyed the1:16:52action choreography in is Flashoint with1:16:55Donny Yen.1:16:56>> Okay.1:16:56>> From I say [clears throat] 20071:16:59thereabouts.1:17:00>> Uh that is very very modern style. So1:17:03it's closer to MMA.1:17:06uh the the end the climactic fight of1:17:09this has some of the hardest hits and1:17:12some amazing ground grappling that thing1:17:14that uh Keanu is doing a a bit a good1:17:18bit of in John1:17:18>> John Wake1:17:20>> in this there's a lot of that and that1:17:22is really complicated uh uh1:17:27and and challenging physical movement1:17:30>> uh is will you will you YouTube this1:17:32thing please uh flashoint end Right.1:17:37See, tossed him and then tossed again1:17:39and stay there. Still don't cut out of1:17:41it.1:17:46>> That's like these guys are taking hits.1:17:48>> Yeah.1:17:50>> Even a controlled fall, you do three1:17:52takes of it.1:17:54>> Like starts to hurt.1:18:00This is where you see how fast Donnie1:18:02is. He's like1:18:05Dude is1:18:15>> how fast his hand is.1:18:20>> And this is this is Donnie when he's1:18:23>> first pause first.1:18:25>> This is him when he's like late 40s1:18:30>> in so you watch some of these1:18:32practitioners in their youth. uh once1:18:35upon a time in China which is uh Jet Le1:18:38and Donnen. These guys when they were1:18:41younger.1:18:43It's crazy how fast and how precise they1:18:46are because both of these guys are at1:18:47that level.1:18:48>> Uh they've done two two films together.1:18:52Uh that one and Hero uh Jiangimu's Hero.1:18:55You haven't seen Hero.1:18:58>> Must watch Hero.1:18:59>> Okay. that has this uh donen and jetly1:19:03uh fight in this uh in the rain in this1:19:05tea garden.1:19:07>> It's like art and poetry and madness.1:19:12>> One thing which the pattern I'm noticing1:19:14is in all these action films. So India1:19:18there is too much reliance on slow1:19:20motion and I think slow motion actually1:19:24like takes me out of the experience.1:19:25Yeah, it kills it. You want it here and1:19:28there just to underline one moment.1:19:31>> Yes.1:19:32>> Your sequence cannot ride on slow1:19:34motion.1:19:34>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.1:19:37So I like the fast impact.1:19:40>> Yeah. That's the pace. You feel like1:19:41there's danger.1:19:42>> Yeah. Yeah.1:19:44>> It's like there's a threat and it is1:19:46happening at such a pace that it1:19:48requires great skill to do this. Yeah.1:19:52>> So I think slow motion and action is a1:19:54very big clutch and I think India is1:19:56highly reliant on it which is1:19:58>> and by and large our action scenes are1:20:01very posy.1:20:02>> They never feel like there is difficulty1:20:07and mastery. the the the the way that1:20:10our action films are generally done, the1:20:13larger than life ones,1:20:15it always feels very posy, you know,1:20:17like the the hero will do one punch, but1:20:20it's like it's more like he's posing and1:20:22showing the bicep and five guys will fly1:20:24like that and he'll stand. I don't even1:20:26have to look at them. I've done this and1:20:28five guys fly. Then I do this and five1:20:32guys have flown that way.1:20:33>> Yeah.1:20:33>> It's in slow motion and it's it's1:20:36effortless. I just have to do this and1:20:39that's where the people are.1:20:40>> Yeah.1:20:41>> I pose, I pose, I pose1:20:44slow motion, slow motion. So it feels it1:20:47doesn't feel like there's dexterity and1:20:51skill1:20:51>> and lately since audience has so much1:20:55exposure to Hollywood world cinema they1:20:58don't buy it like1:21:08knowledge of sense of aesthetic1:21:10heightened date. You can't get away with1:21:12mediocre anymore. This for some1:21:15reason I'm thinking of the action scenes1:21:18of mea which I really enjoyed like I1:21:21think there is a fight scene of Sunil1:21:23Shetty and Shah Rukhan towards the end.1:21:25I I I enjoyed all of it era like I1:21:29bought all of it.1:21:30>> So at that point wire work was a brand1:21:33new thing in Bollywood.1:21:35>> Wire work.1:21:36>> Yeah. where you're wearing a harness and1:21:38you're on cable.1:21:38>> Oh yes yes yes yes1:21:41>> it's something which originated in in1:21:44Hong Kong cinema.1:21:46>> Yeah.1:21:47>> Uh and the Matrix introduced it to1:21:50Hollywood and to the world then it came1:21:53here.1:21:53>> Yeah.1:21:55>> You we would have had safety cable1:21:57safety harness and all but the concept1:22:00uh within it's they call it wirefu like1:22:03kung fu but1:22:04>> wirefu1:22:04>> wirefu. Ooh,1:22:06>> the concept of uh action while using1:22:09wires to make you jump and move and fly.1:22:12>> Yeah,1:22:12>> that was pretty new in in Bollywood at1:22:15that point. So, so Meuna and a bunch of1:22:18films at that point,1:22:20>> it was a brand new toy.1:22:21>> Absolutely.1:22:23>> Yeah. And we were everyone was still1:22:25learning how to use it and fascinated1:22:28with the with1:22:30the the the as a new toy that you can oh1:22:34we can do this we can do that but1:22:35interestingly1:22:38at least like landscape red.1:22:44So I think1:22:47you know this Matrix reloaded1:22:51I think1:22:54and like1:22:56how they got like this 360° camera thing1:22:58just to get that one shot.1:23:00>> Yeah that Matrix shot had blown1:23:03everybody's minds when it came out1:23:06>> around the globe. Hollywood, India, like1:23:10just around the world, the whole world1:23:12collectively went1:23:15>> and everyone then tried to recreate1:23:18that. The the idea that the camera could1:23:21move through time1:23:23>> or the time would freeze and the camera1:23:24would move. It was today it's a lot1:23:27easier to do that effect.1:23:30We have we have the tech now. At that1:23:32point they were inventing the shot. We1:23:35owe a lot as uh as cinema to Matrix,1:23:39right? Like as the film industry, we owe1:23:42a lot to Matrix1:23:43>> globally. Yes. But so also Matrix owes a1:23:46lot to those which came before it. They1:23:48>> father of the film. [laughter] I want to1:23:51like we we were speaking and we had1:23:53discussed we'll do a segment called1:23:55father of the film.1:23:56>> Yeah. Every so often when you watch a1:23:58film which has as you said like the1:24:00matrix is a good example where to us it1:24:02is the starting point for so much stuff.1:24:05But1:24:07>> they've also picked up a lot from1:24:08elsewhere. They are heavily inspired by1:24:10anime. There's a whole bunch of anime1:24:13stories uh anime and manga1:24:16>> that have shaped the development of the1:24:18Matrix. The visual style and even the1:24:20narrative. The action is completely from1:24:23Hong Kong. The uh the action master on1:24:25on the Matrix was Yen Wuing1:24:28>> who is a1:24:30huge legend in Hong Kong action.1:24:32>> Okay.1:24:33in Hong Kong action. Yen Wuing is one of1:24:36the great grandmasters as an action1:24:38choreographer and as a director. He's1:24:40directed1:24:42countless uh Hong Kong action films and1:24:46done action with all of these guys. So1:24:48it was his mastery that the the Wajowski1:24:51recognized and brought him over. So he1:24:54has1:24:54>> then set up a boot camp to train uh all1:24:57of the all of the actors uh got gotten1:25:00the stunt people. He's choreographed the1:25:02action, filmed it. Uh the Matrix till1:25:04today, if you uh is so so so good. The1:25:10uh the initial dojo fight between uh1:25:12Morpheus and Neo.1:25:14>> Yeah.1:25:14>> You watch it today, it's amazing. Uh it1:25:18it it feels so different from what we've1:25:21become used to from Hollywood. They will1:25:23do that again. They will have the two1:25:24shots and you'll see the actors1:25:26performing multiple moves. They they're1:25:27not intercutting and rapid cutting.1:25:29>> Yeah. You can see that's Lawrence1:25:30Fishburn and Keanu Reeves doing all of1:25:32the stuff. It's less cool because, you1:25:35know, at that point the effects have1:25:36come in, but it's a more raw scene. The1:25:38the Morpheus versus New Training fight.1:25:40>> Yeah. Yeah.1:25:41>> Because they're just in a room and you1:25:43can tell these guys have had to do P1:25:46move move here. They're doing eight1:25:48phrases, 11 phrases in a single shot, in1:25:51a two shot. Tough. And [snorts] it it's1:25:54it's really good choreography. That's1:25:56that's why the film just holds so well.1:25:59Yeah.1:26:00>> Uh to us father of the film we we're uh1:26:04we are starting up.1:26:05>> Yeah.1:26:06>> Did you ever watch that uh1:26:09uh the driver? Did you ever1:26:12So I had uh asked you about this whether1:26:16you like drive. Most people everyone on1:26:18the internet likes drive.1:26:19>> Everyone1:26:20>> if you like drive you have to see the1:26:23driver from 1978.1:26:25This is the film that precedes that.1:26:28Just1:26:29>> you open the trailer. Yeah,1:26:30>> YouTube the trailer.1:26:31>> Yeah,1:26:32>> the driver 1978.1:26:34>> Think that they're real cowboys.1:26:36Think that they can just uh1:26:39>> see this shot with the blue light. He's1:26:41driving away. He's a getaway driver.1:26:42>> They want to do1:26:43>> it's drive.1:26:44>> It's drive1:26:45>> whenever they want to do it.1:26:50>> All of these.1:26:50>> Maybe the font also. I don't know.1:26:54>> All of these shots, all of this stuff.1:26:56>> Yeah. We know1:26:57>> other than the fact that1:26:59>> it's an old-fashioned car.1:27:00>> Yeah,1:27:02>> this could be drive.1:27:04>> This is a super cool film just and1:27:08visually also just beautiful beautiful1:27:10cinematography.1:27:12>> So when we talk about father of the1:27:14films, one is uh the driver and drive1:27:17which are some other films. I'm1:27:20fascinated by the uh by seeking out uh1:27:24the inspiration behind any you no art is1:27:27created in a vacuum. So your favorite1:27:30director who has made your favorite film1:27:34what what inspired them when they were1:27:36making their film when they were a young1:27:38film student what were the the films1:27:40that really moved them in such a way1:27:42that it's come into this you can start1:27:44to1:27:45>> pull out the threads and find it. I I I1:27:47love uh finding those the the way this1:27:51has been distilled down into into drive.1:27:54Uh I was recently watching uh1:27:58uh the old Timothy Dalton Bond movies.1:28:00>> Okay.1:28:01>> Uh which I only did two films very good1:28:03Bond uh A View to a Kill and License uh1:28:09no The Living Daylights and License to1:28:12Kill. Those were the two Timothy Dorton1:28:13films. H1:28:15>> The living daylights has so much stuff1:28:18in there that Christopher Nolan has1:28:21picked up and put into his films.1:28:23>> You can tell Nolan is very uh open about1:28:26uh being a fan of the Bond franchise.1:28:29Uh and there are these whole bits in it1:28:31that you look at. uh the the end climax1:28:35action sequence of Living Daylights1:28:38>> uh very clearly served as the1:28:40inspiration for the Bane uh plane hijack1:28:43sequence in Dark Knight Rises. That bit1:28:45where they hijacked the [clears throat]1:28:46plane.1:28:47>> You watch uh The Living Daylights, the1:28:49climactic action sequence is a1:28:51planetoplane action sequence which they1:28:53shot for real1:28:54>> and you can see the the inspiration and1:28:56the feel of that. Uh there is this1:28:59snowmobile chase that that made its way1:29:01into Inception. Yeah.1:29:03>> And this one film has so much that when1:29:05if you're a if you're a Nolan fan and1:29:07you're watching The Living Daylights,1:29:08>> it's like a spot the Nolan film. You can1:29:10It's like, "Oh, this is Inception. Oh,1:29:12this is Dark Knight." Uh, take a look at1:29:15this still from the living daylights1:29:19of Timothy Dalton.1:29:25Uh, name the Nolan film.1:29:29>> Dark Knight Rises. tenant.1:29:32>> Oh, this1:29:33>> remember the the uh the heist the suit1:29:35and1:29:36>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.1:29:37>> So, it's like suit and gas mask.1:29:40Uh there's this whole bit in Africa1:29:42which really feels like the Mombasa1:29:44segment in Inception.1:29:45>> Yes.1:29:46>> There's tremendous deja vu. Uh you you1:29:49can sense that you know a young Nolan1:29:52must have watched this film and said,1:29:53"Hey, this is damn cool."1:29:55Uh so Living Daylights has uh a treasure1:29:59trove of Christopher Nolan action bits.1:30:02Uh what is another you had mentioned1:30:05earlier on F1 how much you had enjoyed1:30:07F1.1:30:08>> Uh for fans of F1 the movie or F1 the1:30:12sport, you you have to find uh Grand1:30:16Prix from 1966 directed by John1:30:19Frankenheimer.1:30:21Uh this film was shot during the 19651:30:24Gro F11:30:26>> season1:30:28uh and has the most stunning race1:30:31cinematography. There is no green1:30:33screen. There is no chroma.1:30:35>> There is nothing. It's all live analog1:30:39film making. Uh John Frankenheimer, some1:30:42of you may recognize him as the guy who1:30:43directed Ronin, uh which also has one of1:30:47the great car chase sequences, one of1:30:49the all-time greats.1:30:54But before he made Ronin, this is what1:30:56John Frankenheimr made. Pull it up on1:30:58YouTube.1:31:00Uh Grand Prix 1966. The whole film is1:31:02actually on YouTube. Huh.1:31:05But the opening sequence uh it opens1:31:08with a race at Monaco. This is like1:31:11classic analog F11:31:15and the race is actually shot on the1:31:17Monaco circuit in 1965 before you know1:31:21before they changed it before new modern1:31:23safety features came in.1:31:262 11:31:36>> every so often just like pause and think1:31:401965.1:31:41>> Yeah.1:31:43And it's inerson.1:31:50>> Wow.1:31:51>> Ferrari number one.1:31:54to the casino square.1:31:56>> And they had to do it all live, all for1:31:58real.1:32:08So all these sorts of shots in the in1:32:10the new F1 movie, they were doing crowd1:32:12replacement, background replacement.1:32:14There's a whole lot of layers of CG that1:32:16were coming in.1:32:17Not just uh uh this is this is not just1:32:20the father of the film of F1 Bazar Madan1:32:25Chopra race. [laughter]1:32:32See these shots1:32:34>> and they get right up in and then1:32:36they've got uh cameras mounted on the1:32:39car1:32:42and those shots then they just they they1:32:45hold and you're you're there. You're1:32:46with the car with the driver analog just1:32:49shaking.1:32:51>> So the immersion of that like see this1:32:55>> these shots these are all real shots1:32:59there is no chroma there's no back1:33:00projection1:33:07this is1:33:08>> this has better relay than the actual F11:33:10we are seeing currently. Yeah.1:33:16>> So, now they start cutting into these1:33:18shots and like they're they're right1:33:19there.1:33:20>> Yeah.1:33:21>> There's a behind thescenes photo from1:33:24from the uh shooting of this which is1:33:27you can find it on the internet1:33:29of a cameraman who's strapped to the1:33:32hood of the car with with like rope.1:33:36>> He's wearing a helmet. He's got rope1:33:38tied around his waist. They've tied him1:33:39onto the hood of the car and he's got a1:33:41shouldermounted camera. That's how1:33:42that's how he's getting the shot.1:33:46>> So good.1:33:47>> So if you're interested in F1, they1:33:49really go in into depth into detail. You1:33:52really feel the race. Uh and they go1:33:57into an interesting layer of depth about1:34:00the uh the psyche and the mentality of1:34:03race car drivers. When I see something1:34:05really horrible, I put my foot down hard1:34:10because I know that everyone else is1:34:13lifting his.1:34:14>> What a terrible way to win.1:34:16>> There is no terrible way to win. There1:34:18is only winning.1:34:20>> This particularly was at a time when uh1:34:23the safety regulations, safety standards1:34:25were nothing close to what they are1:34:26today. So accidents, injury and death1:34:29were a far more common part of the1:34:31process.1:34:32Uh so the film looks at that and uh you1:34:36know1:34:37uh spoiler alert but there is an1:34:40incident and there is a death uh uh1:34:43somewhere uh within the middle of the1:34:45film and then the film and the1:34:48characters have to reckon with that.1:34:50Okay, a man has died today but the race1:34:54weekend is not over. We're going out to1:34:55race tomorrow. How do you when a person1:34:58who you know a friend of yours has died1:35:00on the track, how do you go back out and1:35:03keep racing? What is the what is the1:35:04psyche of of race car drivers? All of1:35:08all of those layers the the the film1:35:11opens it up and explores it in a in a1:35:13more interesting way. So I I found a lot1:35:16more depth.1:35:17>> Interestingly SI scene F1 maybe the1:35:20movie but it was an accident which1:35:22happens. The guy doesn't die1:35:24>> but he's in the hospital. Um, another1:35:27like uh racing film that I really like1:35:29is Ron Howard's Rush.1:35:31>> Rush. Yeah,1:35:32>> Rush is such a good film and it also1:35:33shows the psyche of two drivers. Two1:35:36very different people and one is1:35:38likable, one is not likable. I like also1:35:40noticing choreography in such films like1:35:43one film where I which has nothing to do1:35:46with action but I love the choreography1:35:48of is Challengers1:35:50>> the tennis film.1:35:51Yeah, that's a If you've ever watched1:35:54the breakdown in the making of that1:35:56film, you think that they're playing1:35:58tennis. They've built the these entire1:36:01environments are CG constructed. Uh they1:36:05they have doubles playing tennis, face1:36:07replacement, uh virtual camera. So much1:36:11of that is1:36:14uh is is constructed with visual1:36:15effects. Not saying this to disrespect1:36:17the film. just how much invisible visual1:36:21effects has gone into that film that you1:36:22have no idea about. Yeah,1:36:23>> you're thinking1:36:26the amount of prep and planning and1:36:28designing of those sequences, you know,1:36:30cameras floating around.1:36:33>> It's not just like a a spider cam rig or1:36:36something like this. It's it is1:36:38complicated visual effects.1:36:40>> You remember that shot? Glass say the1:36:43code becomes of glasses1:36:46that was Yeah.1:36:48So to get all of that stuff, it's a1:36:52surprisingly technical film. Bahar. So1:36:55you're thinking tennis1:36:56>> and great soundtrack. Such1:36:59>> amazing.1:37:00>> Trent Resner, Actus Ross. Yeah.1:37:02>> Shout out to those boys. Another1:37:03precursor.1:37:05Uh if you like Pirates of the Caribbean,1:37:07if you enjoy Pirates of the Caribbean,1:37:08check out Cutthroat Island.1:37:10>> Okay.1:37:10>> 1995. Gina Davis. Mhm.1:37:13>> Uh it's very famous as a film that1:37:16bankrupted the studio1:37:18>> uh and was for the long time held the1:37:21record of the most expensive flop ever.1:37:23But everything that works in Pirates of1:37:26the Caribbean, the you know, action,1:37:27adventure, comedy, pirate space, when1:37:31you watch it through today's eyes,1:37:33>> h1:37:34>> uh the the story is uneven,1:37:38>> but the scale of the production, the1:37:40special effects, the action sequences,1:37:42because they've done it all live.1:37:44They're blowing up ships, they're out on1:37:46the water. It's it's quite uh quite1:37:48awesome. Michael man uh has1:37:51fascinatingly uh made the father of his1:37:54own film. Uh if you like heat then you1:37:57have to watch thief1:37:59>> which is his earlier film which is in a1:38:03lot of ways kind of the a study of that1:38:06and if you want to go one step there's1:38:08this a TV movie which he made called LA1:38:11Takedown.1:38:12>> Okay. So between LA Takedown and Thief,1:38:17both of those films together are kind of1:38:19the testing ground for heat. It's like1:38:23he rehearsal and practice, rehearsal and1:38:25practice, trial run, trial run, and he1:38:27took everything from Thief and LA1:38:30Takedown, tidied it up, and that's why1:38:32heat is the cracker that it is.1:38:35>> He's already done a few trial runs1:38:38>> before. So Thief, amazing. Uh James1:38:43James Khan1:38:45uh wonderful performance from him also.1:38:48>> I can see my money is still in your1:38:51pocket which is from the yield of my1:38:53labor.1:38:56>> What gratitude1:38:59>> film the film that came before the1:39:01father of the film Delhi belly.1:39:03[laughter]1:39:04>> Delhi belly owes a very big debt to1:39:06locktock and two smoking barrels. That1:39:08is the that is the the direct one. I1:39:11know that when I was uh I think I was 151:39:14when Locktock released and I know when I1:39:17watched that film some again something1:39:20happened in my brain. One tick happened1:39:23>> because it was a type of film that I had1:39:25never seen before. It was doing1:39:27something that I had never seen before1:39:28and it's like the question came came up1:39:30in your head. You're like1:39:34I didn't know you could do that. It was1:39:36I had it set in my head that in my life1:39:40which hits this space the crime caper1:39:43comedy that that is Locktock when I1:39:47first read the audition scenes for Daily1:39:49Belly instantly my mind went to Locktock1:39:54>> this is that and for Akshhat as well1:39:56that that was uh that was a reference1:39:59point. I want to talk to you about some1:40:02of the upcoming films of the year and1:40:04like are you excited about them? What1:40:06are your thoughts about first of all the1:40:07Odyssey?1:40:09>> Medium level excitement.1:40:10>> Why just medium?1:40:12>> There's a Nolan fanboy inside me1:40:15>> that want that keeps wishing that he1:40:17would do uh something Inceptionesque.1:40:22You know, when when Tenet was coming1:40:24out, it had the vibe of Inception.1:40:28uh it felt like maybe it could exist in1:40:30the same universe if we consider that to1:40:32be a thing of you know it's slightly1:40:36futuristic sci-fi but still in our world1:40:39kind of a crime thriller film so it's1:40:42this interesting blend1:40:44>> uh if if you get what I mean about you1:40:47know inception and ten it existing in1:40:49the same universe1:40:52>> the the Nolan fanboy inside me keeps1:40:54wishing1:40:57Yeah, swords and sandals space.1:41:01Uh, I'm not that excited to see him1:41:03explore that. Obviously, I'll watch the1:41:05film as as we all will.1:41:08>> Uh, but I keep saying,1:41:13>> why do you think Tenet did not work?1:41:16What was the problem with Tenet?1:41:18>> My take on it uh is that the human story1:41:22didn't work.1:41:24Uh, Inception is, you know, for all of1:41:27the coolness and the the1:41:29mind-blowingness of the plot and the and1:41:31all of that at its core, the human story1:41:34really connected.1:41:35>> Yes.1:41:35>> You really care about this guy and his1:41:38quest to get back home.1:41:40>> Yeah,1:41:40>> it's the Odyssey. [laughter]1:41:43>> The emotional journey of uh of Cobb.1:41:46>> You care about it. You're invested in1:41:48it. And you also buy into uh the that1:41:52that complex uh and slightly problematic1:41:56romantic track. The version of his wife1:41:58who he has trapped in his mind. It stirs1:42:01the emotion. Uh I felt that the1:42:04emotional parts of Tenant never landed.1:42:06It was true.1:42:08>> It was bland.1:42:08>> I think this is the end of a beautiful1:42:10friendship, but for me it's just the1:42:12beginning. So for all of the coolness1:42:14and I I really enjoy the uh the1:42:17mechanics of the time reversal and you1:42:19know I still watch those bits. I really1:42:21enjoy those. I never invested in the1:42:23characters.1:42:25The emotional part was was cold.1:42:27>> The emotional part that Nolan got really1:42:30right was in the film Prestige.1:42:33>> Probably his best film either because1:42:36the screenplay of that film is a master1:42:40masterclass. the screenplay and the1:42:41editing.1:42:43Uh1:42:45it's it's it's a puzzle box of a film1:42:48because you will see parts of a scene1:42:50early in the film but not the rest of it1:42:53and then later in the film you'll see1:42:56the rest of that scene which will give1:42:57you more context. The way that that is1:43:00structured at a screenplay level and the1:43:02way that it is edited together, it's1:43:04like a very complicated watch with all1:43:06of these these little parts. It really1:43:07had genius work. You always were the1:43:10better magician.1:43:12We both know that. Whatever your secret1:43:15was, you have to agree.1:43:18Mine is better.1:43:19>> Was it N? The Nolan film, Insomnia.1:43:22>> Yes.1:43:22>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's also1:43:24>> that was Yeah. His first studio film,1:43:27but it was not it was not his script. Uh1:43:29it's a it's a remake of a Norwegian1:43:34uh film, I think.1:43:36>> Are you also into drama films? Yeah,1:43:40human relation stories I I do really1:43:42enjoy.1:43:42>> Yes, sir.1:43:43>> Yes, sir. Yes, sir.1:43:44>> I've been doing a little bit of a Paul1:43:45Newman uh binge. Big big big fan of Paul1:43:48Newman.1:43:49>> In his later years, uh late '9s, early1:43:522000s, he made a couple of films.1:43:55>> One in uh 94 called Nobody's Fool.1:43:59>> Okay.1:44:00>> Uh 98, same director uh they repeated he1:44:04made a film called uh1:44:07Twilight.1:44:08Okay,1:44:09>> so Nobody's Fooled, followed up by1:44:11Twilight. I I watched all of these films1:44:13kind of back to back in a short span.1:44:17>> Twilight is amazing. It's got Paul1:44:18Newman, Gene Hackman, uh Susan Sandon,1:44:21is it?1:44:23>> Yes.1:44:24>> Yeah. And these are pretty simple films,1:44:28you know, uh but you're seeing towering1:44:33actors like an actor of Gene Hackman's1:44:35caliber and Paul Newman's caliber. You1:44:37just put these two guys in a scene and1:44:40have them talk.1:44:41>> You say you're my friend.1:44:46Is that the truth?1:44:50That's the truth.1:44:52I'm satisfied.1:44:54>> It's amazing. You know, you you don't1:44:56need space lasers or, you know,1:44:59[clears throat]1:45:00giant special effects. You just have two1:45:02of the finest actors. You put them in a1:45:05room and you have them play out a scene1:45:08with some some subtext and stuff.1:45:10>> Yeah.1:45:11>> It's such a joy to watch. Watching1:45:14Hackman and Newman do scenes together.1:45:16Mind-blowing.1:45:18>> Uh and then on my on my Paul Newman uh1:45:22journey, I just uh watched this1:45:24miniseries which is on Hot Star called1:45:27Empire Falls.1:45:28>> Okay.1:45:29>> Uh this has a crazy star cast. Ed1:45:32Harris, Paul Newman, Philip Seymour1:45:35Hoffman,1:45:37>> and it just goes on and on like what a1:45:40cast.1:45:40>> How is it that there is a work of Philip1:45:43Seymour Hoffman that I haven't seen? I1:45:45try to consume everything of Philip1:45:47Seymour Hoffman.1:45:48>> Yeah. Simp. It's a two-part miniseries,1:45:502 hours, 2 hours each episode. Uh, and1:45:54simple human story. It's a small town.1:45:56Ed Harris is Paul Newman's son. So Paul1:46:00Newman is this uh relentlessly uh free1:46:04spirit. He's a guy who's never uh uh1:46:08never quite settled down, never had a1:46:10decent job. He's, you know, and his son1:46:13Ed Harris is a guy who has spent his1:46:15life believing that you keep your head1:46:18in line, you work hard, you save money,1:46:20you send,1:46:23>> you know what I mean? Take money from a1:46:25scenile old priest.1:46:27>> I never took a dime. No, you just let1:46:30him pay for everything.1:46:31>> Well, why shouldn't he have a little1:46:32fun? Old men like to have fun, too, you1:46:35know.1:46:36>> And the small town politics, the human1:46:38relationships with it. There's no big1:46:40drama in it.1:46:41>> It's just seeing Ed Harris and Paul1:46:44Newman and Philip Seymour Hoffman doing1:46:46a scene together.1:46:47>> Wow.1:46:48>> Yeah.1:46:50>> Absolutely.1:46:50>> Like bar actors. and they're not then1:46:54trying to do something fantastical and1:46:56and sell you on uh you know some1:46:59fantasy. It's human stuff. You're like,1:47:02"Yeah, I can I can relate to this as a1:47:05father, as a son, as a brother, as a guy1:47:07who's got a friend who's a pain in the1:47:08ass." Seeing them do that thing, you're1:47:12like, "Yay, yay." Human acting with1:47:15layers and complexity. And1:47:18so uh that that was my my big trip in1:47:21the last few months and of what was Paul1:47:23Newman doing in later years. Let's talk1:47:26more about books1:47:33which are some other books before I get1:47:35into like the larger territory film1:47:37related books filmmaker related books1:47:39that you like. I think you also like the1:47:41Hitchcock1:47:42>> uh Hitchcock on Yeah. by uh Trufo on1:47:44Hitchcock. Yeah.1:47:46>> Also found that to be very very uh1:47:49informative because this is one1:47:52filmmaker quizzing another filmmaker.1:47:55>> Yeah.1:48:00In that way. So it's it's it's1:48:03fascinating to see a filmmaker quizzing1:48:07another filmmaker on creative choices.1:48:10Why did you do this? How did you think1:48:11of this? And Hitchcock is uh rightly uh1:48:15very revered as a director's director as1:48:19one who put a lot of stock and a lot of1:48:22thought into the role of the director1:48:25into the craft of the director.1:48:27>> The medium of pure cinema is what I1:48:30believe in. Um this the assembly of1:48:34pieces of film to create fright is the1:48:38essential part of my job. bringing all1:48:41of these pieces together and I'm showing1:48:44you the correct thing at the correct1:48:45moment. I'm making you hear the correct1:48:47thing at the correct time so that you1:48:49feel a certain thing. Maybe I don't want1:48:51you to understand something right now. I1:48:53want to hide something from you.1:48:55>> Yeah.1:48:56>> How much of that director's mind and1:48:58director's craft uh is is is in your1:49:02hands? I think it's it's from uh1:49:05Hitchcock's interview that I that I as a1:49:08young film student I started to1:49:10understand1:49:12why is he putting the camera here? Why1:49:14is he doing this?1:49:16Uh there's this great uh1:49:21little tidbit from uh which was the film1:49:26Rosemary's Baby.1:49:28>> Amazing famous shot that that is framed1:49:30slightly off center. Okay. Uh she's1:49:33she's sitting on the bed and you know1:49:36making a call or something. Yes, I1:49:39>> and we can see her through the doorway,1:49:42>> but the camera is positioned just1:49:44slightly off over here so that you can't1:49:46quite see her. So the second it gets to1:49:49this instinctively as a viewer1:49:55>> zoom zoom zoom zoom1:49:57>> the director has intentionally obscured.1:50:01Now if you were here and you wanted to1:50:03see this, what would you do?1:50:06You're looking at this instinctively.1:50:09>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.1:50:12>> And that's what is it engages you where1:50:15as a viewer earlier on if everything is1:50:18coming till you hear you can sit back1:50:21then you can start scrolling on your1:50:23phone also because I don't even need to1:50:24watch.1:50:26This is a way to draw you in. If you1:50:30hide something in shadow, if a if a1:50:32character is doing a thing, then there's1:50:34a viewer like1:50:38we we are subconsciously trained to1:50:42believe in cinematic language. If I pull1:50:47out a thing1:50:49and do this, we are trained to believe1:50:53insert shot to show us.1:50:57And when the camera doesn't do that,1:51:00like in Pulp Fiction, when they when he1:51:03opens the briefcase and the camera1:51:05doesn't cut to show us what's inside,1:51:08instinctively we lean forward like1:51:10>> Yeah.1:51:12>> Because we are expecting, right?1:51:17>> What did he just look at? What was1:51:19there? It it is a way of drawing the1:51:23audience in.1:51:24>> Yeah. You're kind of subverting their1:51:26expectation.1:51:28Subconsciously they have an expectation.1:51:31We understand what will happen.1:51:33>> Yeah.1:51:36>> It it catches you. Now you're involved.1:51:39Now you're engaged.1:51:41Ideally, as a filmmaker, there are key1:51:44moments where you want the person to1:51:47lean forward.1:51:49I want you to come closer and pay pay1:51:51more attention to this thing. How do I1:51:53get you to do that?1:51:55Yeah, it can be very unsettling.1:52:00>> Till today the internet is on fire with1:52:03debates what is in the briefcase in pulp1:52:04fiction.1:52:07>> Till today people are speculating wildly1:52:09that are all theories.1:52:11>> Yeah.1:52:13>> What happens to the top at the end of1:52:14inception?1:52:17>> Discuss1:52:19make the viewer a participant in the1:52:21thing.1:52:22you you you draw them in. You don't give1:52:24them everything and you say you have to1:52:26do a little bit. This is a a simple uh1:52:30version of that. You're expecting this1:52:32is the frame. By doing this, I mean it1:52:35forces everyone to try and adjust.1:52:38>> I think the true for Hitchcock book was1:52:41also recommended by Anurak Kaship,1:52:43right? Like he calls it one of the best1:52:45like books on film making.1:52:47>> He signed my copy.1:52:48>> He signed his copy also. Yeah, we had1:52:50him last season.1:52:53filmmakers1:52:55by for which I think is one of the1:52:57greatest books to learn film making from1:52:59Paul Newman if you can find his1:53:01biography they released it fairly1:53:02recently it's a semi-autobiography1:53:05>> okay1:53:06>> partially self-written partially uh1:53:08essays and uh bits written by his1:53:11friends and family1:53:13>> so I I read that and that is what1:53:16inspired me to start seeking out his uh1:53:20later years the work of his later is you1:53:22know extraordinary life of an ordinary1:53:24man.1:53:25>> Which are some other books that you like1:53:28which are about filmmakers films?1:53:32>> About filmmakers I like to uh hear from1:53:36them in their own voice.1:53:38>> Yeah.1:53:39>> So whenever there is an actor or a1:53:41director who has written something and1:53:42you can get a sense from them.1:53:45Kurosawa's uh autobiography1:53:48uh was a good one. you can hear from1:53:51their uh in their eyes what they were1:53:55trying to do and what they thought about1:53:57it and what they felt about it.1:53:58>> Yeah.1:53:59>> From our side, you know, we watch it you1:54:02uh kind of complete1:54:03>> and with the lens of history.1:54:06By the time you sat down to watch1:54:07Godfather, you already knew this is one1:54:09of the greatest films of all time.1:54:10Marlon Brando was one of the greatest1:54:12actors of all time. You knew this before1:54:13you even started the film.1:54:16to watch it and understand what were1:54:18they thinking and feeling while they1:54:20were making it.1:54:22>> You know, what was he trying to do? What1:54:24was his what was his driving force? What1:54:27was his inspiration? What were the1:54:29hurdles?1:54:31I I find it illuminating and and1:54:33fascinating to get that behind the1:54:36scenes. Uh Newman, it turns out, was a1:54:40deeply troubled guy.1:54:41>> Okay.1:54:42uh struggled for a lot of his life with1:54:45uh with alcoholism1:54:48>> uh and with a whole myriad of emotional,1:54:52psychological baggage and anxieties and1:54:55and all of this stuff. He he talks about1:54:58some of it. Uh his friends and family1:55:02address some of it and it comes out this1:55:05this is what this man was carrying1:55:06around1:55:07>> while he was making those films. It's a1:55:10very um rare thing when you get to read1:55:13truthful biographies. Sometimes they1:55:16also feel like like very PR driven1:55:23>> those are uninteresting. Those are1:55:24uninteresting1:55:25>> when you hear from a person and you can1:55:27tell1:55:33this I think I had once read Bergman's1:55:36like biography1:55:38I got to know that he had a massive1:55:41problem of diarrhea and like on every1:55:44set1:55:46because at any time1:55:48>> he would have to use the washroom. So1:55:52this [laughter]1:55:54another another book I really like is1:55:57Andrit Aaroski's sculpting in time.1:55:59>> I've not read it.1:56:00>> Uh it's the autobiography of Andrit1:56:02Aarosski.1:56:04>> Have you seen his films?1:56:05>> No, I know who he is. I have not. So I1:56:08pick a channel and I go deep and then I1:56:13uh this is my whatever film nerd1:56:15approach. I don't go wide, I go deep. So1:56:19I pick a thread and then I go deep deep1:56:21deep deep deep and then I pick another1:56:23thread and I go deep deep deep deep deep1:56:28uh tarovski have not started.1:56:30>> I think you'll really like1:56:34every frame is alive.1:56:36>> Yeah. No doubt moment I I every so often1:56:40there's a this is the thing and then I1:56:42go very very deep into that because my1:56:45my attention is then I want to know1:56:47everything about that one.1:56:48>> Yeah. There's another book that I really1:56:52liked. It is David Lynch's catching the1:56:55big fish. Okay.1:56:57>> It is just about how he gets these ideas1:56:59and how you always have to wait to get1:57:01the big fish and1:57:04because he was into transcendental1:57:05meditation. So a lot of his life was1:57:08dedicated to like TM it is called. So he1:57:12has talked about that like how he would1:57:14wait for the like the big idea to come1:57:16in. I love like reading about filmmakers1:57:19a lot.1:57:20>> I have a really good book uh this big1:57:23fat volume I forget it's called1:57:26conversations with uh Hollywood's golden1:57:29age filmmakers.1:57:30>> Okay. So it's actually a collection of1:57:33uh like this whichever the uh some1:57:37theater some company somewhere over the1:57:40years was would host conversations with1:57:42filmmakers. Uh so that is the collection1:57:45the trans collected transcripts of those1:57:47here. What is it the great movie makers1:57:50Hollywood's golden age1:57:51>> nice1:57:52>> so it is a collected transcript of all1:57:56of the conversations with these1:57:57filmmakers. So AK K you've got like you1:58:00know Billy Wilder and uh1:58:04uh Howard Hawks and all of the guys of1:58:06the uh Hollywood's golden age Ernst1:58:09Lubich1:58:11uh so you really get a sense of the1:58:15challenges that they were facing as as1:58:17makers as technicians1:58:20uh of1:58:22how they were solving problems. M1:58:26>> I I find that there is a value in1:58:30understanding1:58:31uh how makers approach something1:58:35before they had all of the tools which1:58:37we have. It keeps getting easier. We1:58:39have more and more toys and tools to1:58:41make films nowadays.1:58:44>> What was it like when these guys didn't1:58:45have all of that? How are they able to1:58:47create uh impactful stories without any1:58:52of the toys which we now have?1:58:54uh that is is interesting to me. I had1:58:58reached a place recently of feeling here1:59:03now the audience has become uh so immune1:59:07to to these narratives. They've seen so1:59:09much. We're all a little cynical.1:59:11Everything has been done. So now you uh1:59:15you can no longer move people or how do1:59:17you do anything without more more?1:59:22And then I saw this film Perfect Days.1:59:24>> Yeah.1:59:26>> And1:59:29I was blown away that a director has1:59:33done so much with1:59:36a public toilet. Absolutely.1:59:41It's a public toilet. A space that is1:59:43smaller than this.1:59:47It's a a silent mode. There's no1:59:49dialogue. How the hell do you do so1:59:53much? How do you tell so much story1:59:56with so little?2:00:00And how does an actor2:00:04say so much and do so much without2:00:06words?2:00:08It absolutely flawed me. Like I it2:00:11knocked me down onto the floor.2:00:16How can you do how can you do this?2:00:21Uh and it for me reinforced and it gave2:00:25me the idea that2:00:34somebody can do it. There are some2:00:36masters out there whose craft is at such2:00:38a level2:00:40that with nothing they can tell you this2:00:44amazing story. So it means that the2:00:47magic is still there. We just have to2:00:49work a little harder.2:00:50>> Yeah. And you are talking about2:00:52absolutely the correct film in that2:00:55regard. Key we are over stimulated to a2:00:59point right now when you suddenly watch2:01:02perfect days do the job better than any2:01:05of the other overstimulating films2:01:07language of the shadows like when you2:01:10are seeing these reflection of trees you2:01:12are seeing this guy who is just waiting2:01:14to do his photography2:01:19like2:01:23it is that but from2:01:26From a a craft lens, it is also like the2:01:29ultimate flex.2:01:30>> Ultimate flex 100%.2:01:32>> Beta2:01:36like it's a it's like a challenge to2:01:38every director out there.2:01:42>> We have a very interesting segment since2:01:45Audible is one of our partners on the2:01:47show segment. Audible audition. So piece2:01:51of paper and uh it is a segment from an2:01:55audio book and you have to read it out2:01:58loud and then we'll tell you the audio2:02:00book it is from and you might find the2:02:01bit interesting.2:02:03>> Okay.2:02:13>> I think to myself,2:02:15is this jump off a building really2:02:17necessary?2:02:19But the answer's there as soon as I ask2:02:20the question. Yes,2:02:22because this jump is special. It isn't2:02:25just for the fans and the critics and2:02:27the box office charts.2:02:30This one is for the man who made it2:02:31possible for me to stand here today,2:02:33aching and shivering in the spotlight.2:02:37This is for my master, Eugene Yuen, who2:02:40was buried a week ago in Los Angeles.2:02:45I remember a frightened seven-year-old2:02:47walking to the dark and musty halls of2:02:49the China Drama Academy,2:02:52holding his father's hand. Inside, he2:02:55sees young boys and girls leaping and2:02:56tumbling and screaming.2:02:59"How long do you want to stay here,2:03:00Jackie?"2:03:02"Forever," answers the boy, his eyes2:03:04bright and wide. And he lets go of his2:03:07father to clutch at the hem of his2:03:08master's robe.2:03:10>> So, this is from the2:03:11>> It's Jackie Chan surely. Yes, I am2:03:13Jackie Janis the audio book.2:03:15>> The formula is simple. The more2:03:17terrified my friends and family are, the2:03:20more satisfied my fans will be. And they2:03:23mean everything to me.2:03:25>> If I have to in general take your book2:03:28recommendations across genres, which are2:03:29some of your favorite books?2:03:31>> One of my favorite authors of all time2:03:33is Bill Bryson.2:03:34>> He's the teacher we never had.2:03:35[laughter]2:03:36>> Yeah.2:03:38I can never get bored of reading his2:03:40books because there's so much material2:03:42in it.2:03:43>> Yeah.2:03:43>> Uh my my favorite book of his is called2:03:46At Home.2:03:47>> At home.2:03:48>> At home.2:03:49>> Okay.2:03:49>> Uh it is a history of how we live. He2:03:54started with this idea. He said okay in2:03:56today's day2:03:58you can go anywhere on earth and there2:04:01are some things which are just2:04:04recognizable. uh you know putting aside2:04:07you know financial situation all of this2:04:11in any home in any culture there are2:04:14you'll expect to find2:04:17>> a kitchen sink there will be a fridge2:04:20perhaps there will be a pot there will2:04:23be you know uh a clothes iron whatever2:04:28there are some things which you're like2:04:29huh everywhere on earth2:04:32his question was how did we arrive at2:04:35How did each one of these arrive here?2:04:38So he wants to he's gone back to trace2:04:40the history of today we have a kitchen2:04:43and a bedroom and we differentiate2:04:46between them but was it how did we2:04:48arrive at that standard? What was the2:04:50normal number of rooms in a house? How2:04:53did the idea of2:04:57why not in the same place?2:04:59>> Wow. The entire history of how the norms2:05:03of how we live evolved.2:05:05Originally humans were just trying to2:05:07build some kind of a shelter against the2:05:09elements.2:05:10>> It is one structure. You just sit inside2:05:12to hide from the rain. A k you can maybe2:05:15build a fire.2:05:17>> The evolution from there outwards.2:05:19>> Yeah.2:05:20How did we have clocks on the walls?2:05:23Where did glass come from? the the2:05:25growth and the evolution and the2:05:27earliest version of each thing2:05:29>> and what was the earliest version of2:05:31this like one space where we have2:05:33everything.2:05:35>> Uh so the history of human habitation2:05:40goes back somewhere 15 20,000 years ago2:05:45is the earliest examples that we have2:05:48been able to find.2:05:50Uh and in this also there are2:05:52interesting anomalies.2:05:54uh where this is I have completely2:05:56forgotten but one of the earliest uh2:05:59human settlements that he's talking2:06:00about2:06:02uh was built much like a hive. So this2:06:05the the structures are all built side by2:06:07side but the entryways there are no2:06:10doors. The entry is on the roof.2:06:13>> So if you want to get to your house you2:06:16have to climb up and you're walking2:06:17across 20 roofs and then you get to2:06:19yours and you open it and you enter2:06:20here. So all the houses were entered2:06:23vertically.2:06:25Today we consider it the norm that you2:06:27enter from a door which is in in the2:06:29wall. But in these older settlements for2:06:34whatever their reasons were at that time2:06:36it seemed to be best to enter the2:06:39history of building materials. How are2:06:42you constructing2:06:43from basic wood and you know thatch roof2:06:47you're piling mud together trying to2:06:49move rocks trying to shape rocks. So2:06:53geographically, culturally,2:06:55technologically as as it as it grew,2:06:58what are the building materials that2:07:00they could use? A lot of uh older2:07:03structures were built entirely out of2:07:06wood. So they can find a little bit of a2:07:08footprint.2:07:10structure.2:07:12Was it 8 ft tall or 11 ft? Was it 14 ft?2:07:16Who can tell? Was the roof flat? Was it2:07:19like this? Cannot say.2:07:21>> No, it's very interesting key why we do2:07:23certain things the way we do. know I2:07:26don't know if you've seen this meme2:07:31suddenly realizes I don't need to take2:07:33my hand up there2:07:36and [laughter] he flips2:07:40let's just do this so a lot of things2:07:42like that why we do certain things and2:07:45you know Bill Bryson is also the guy who2:07:47gave me the knowledge the school never2:07:49gave me I think I was very timid in2:07:51school.2:07:56Then I read an entire history of nearly2:07:59everything. It made me understand how2:08:02the world works.2:08:08Bryson.2:08:10Yeah. Yeah.2:08:11>> And the2:08:15a lot of stuff you know we will get some2:08:17information that they have discovered2:08:19some settlement which is 700 years old.2:08:24Now how can you say it is 700 and not2:08:271100?2:08:28>> Fair how how are we able to or even2:08:32going even further back you will find2:08:35fossils or dinosaur bones and you can2:08:37say by this is 7 million years old. That2:08:40one is 11 million years old. How the2:08:43hell do you tell the difference between2:08:44something that is 7 and 11 million years2:08:46old?2:08:49There is a system to it which you know2:08:51in short history of nearly everything.2:08:53He describes2:08:54>> how they are able to go back how many uh2:08:57there is geological records. They have2:09:00an understanding of acha at this point2:09:02some volcanic eruption has happened on2:09:05on such and such date. So it has sent2:09:06sulfur out. So if you are able to find2:09:08sulfur molecules over here. So there are2:09:11all of these little little2:09:14highly scientific uh processes by which2:09:17they have arrived and by which they can2:09:19say this is 10 million years old, this2:09:21is 1,000 years old, this is 500 years2:09:24old and they actually do know that2:09:27so much of it is an utter mystery that2:09:29you can sit at this end and say2:09:34>> yeah. So to have an actual2:09:39replicate of it, but2:09:44>> everything that Bryson has written, I2:09:47devour on on repeat. Short history of2:09:51nearly everything. His latest one was2:09:52what? The body.2:09:54>> Oh, the body. Yes.2:09:55>> Al also a very interesting one.2:09:57>> Have you read his the Shakespeare book?2:09:59>> Yeah, I loved it.2:10:00>> Yeah,2:10:01>> it was amazing. like so much uh so much2:10:06stuff that you didn't know and it's uh2:10:08the the the genius thing also that came2:10:10out of that was how little we actually2:10:11know about him.2:10:12>> Yes. Yes.2:10:14>> Such little information about one of the2:10:16most uh important literary figures2:10:21and also that2:10:23uh he never spelled his name the way we2:10:25spell it.2:10:26>> Yeah. Yeah. the the common spelling that2:10:28we all know s h a k e s p e a r e p e a2:10:34r e shakes2:10:37>> uh in his handwriting he never wrote it2:10:39that way he wrote Shakespeare without2:10:42the e in the middle he wrote Shakespeare2:10:44without the e at the end2:10:46>> he's written a couple of versions2:10:48>> in legal documents but he himself never2:10:50used the spelling that that we know2:10:54>> we don't know which order his plays were2:10:55written2:10:57Yeah.2:10:59>> Uh so much of so much of it is is just2:11:02fascinating to understand.2:11:05We know so little about this guy2:11:09>> and like a an amazing rabbit hole within2:11:13that is how how many uh words and2:11:17phrases that we use commonly2:11:20originated with this man. This man has2:11:24invented words and phrases.2:11:25>> Yeah.2:11:26>> That we use on the common. When you say2:11:29eyeball,2:11:30no one had ever put the word I and ball2:11:32together into a single word2:11:36until Mr. Shakespeare.2:11:39It's2:11:41mindboggling. It's endless the kinds the2:11:44just phrases that we use in passing just2:11:48on the on the dayto-day like2:11:56the guy wrote everything2:11:57>> and he wrote all versions of stories2:11:59possible.2:12:02I think we are just going back to2:12:03everything Shakespeare has ever written2:12:05>> and so much of it holds so beautifully2:12:08today.2:12:10uh the humanity of it and the social2:12:14commentary. So much of it still rings2:12:17true and still holds value today. It's2:12:20incredible. Uh I I want to say it was2:12:22this year or last year where very2:12:24recently like within the past past uh 62:12:288 months2:12:30uh sir Ian Mckllen was on uh on Steven2:12:35Colbear's show.2:12:36>> Okay.2:12:37uh and he did a little uh a little uh2:12:42recitation from Shakespeare.2:12:44>> It's a commentary on uh on immigration2:12:47and on immigrants2:12:49and it it feels so authentic even till2:12:52today.2:12:54>> Uh are are you volunteering to find this2:12:56in there? Ian Mckllen.2:12:58>> So in order to set it up, we really need2:13:00somebody to shout that the strangers2:13:02should be removed. Could someone do2:13:04that?2:13:04>> The crowd is saying2:13:06stable should be removed removed.2:13:12>> And grant that this YOUR NOISE HAVE CHIT2:13:14down all the majesty of England. Imagine2:13:17that you see the wretched strangers2:13:19their babies at their backs. You must2:13:22needs be strangers.2:13:26Would you be pleased2:13:28to find a nation of such barbarous2:13:30temper that breaking out in idious2:13:32violence would not afford you an abroad2:13:35on earth?2:13:37wet their detested lives against your2:13:40throats,2:13:41spurn you like dogs, and like as if that2:13:44God owned not, nor made not you, nor2:13:48that the elements were not all2:13:50appropriate to your comforts, but2:13:53chartered unto them.2:13:56What would you think2:13:59to be thus used?2:14:03This2:14:05is the strangest case and this your2:14:10mountedness2:14:12in humanity.2:14:16William Shakespeare 400 years ago.2:14:19[cheering]2:14:22Like what [snorts] a master2:14:27like his cadence, his pitch, how he's2:14:30like the mastery of his craft just you2:14:34and what's the name of that guy?2:14:36Billions main actor search billions cast2:14:39actor Damian Lewis Mark Anthony.2:14:42>> Yeah. Yeah.2:14:44>> Bro, that is such just play 10 seconds2:14:46of it like he's so good.2:14:50>> Yeah. The Yeah. First one. First one2:14:54Shakespeare. This particular passage2:14:57from Julius Caesar. Friends, Romans,2:15:00>> country,2:15:01>> countrymen, lend me your ears.2:15:04I come to bury Caesar, not to praise2:15:07him. The evil that men do lives after2:15:11them. The good is often turred with2:15:14their bones. So let it be with Caesar.2:15:19The noble Brutus had told you Caesar was2:15:21ambitious. If it were so, it was a2:15:24grievous fault.2:15:25>> You can pause it. He has seen it. But2:15:27yeah, like I love this bit so much. And2:15:30he's also such a fabulous actor. Damian2:15:32Lewis.2:15:33>> So Shakespeare clip I will subject you2:15:36to2:15:36>> you find David Tenant Hamlet.2:15:40>> Uh will you play upon this pipe?2:15:45So just a little context uh if you have2:15:47not seen or read Hamlet2:15:50uh he is the prince uh his father has2:15:55been assassinated and uh his uncle is2:15:58seeking to usurp the throne of isme2:16:03there are a bunch of other people who2:16:05are playing politics where these guys2:16:08are trying to massage him they're like2:16:10you know sir sir but I s you are a very2:16:13great genius sir2:16:15and he is uh challenging that part. So2:16:19here again he does the thing of speaking2:16:20Shakespeare in language but where it2:16:22feels like he's speaking this normally2:16:25today so that the will you play upon2:16:27this pipe is he does this genius it's2:16:30it's a it's a trap that he's setting for2:16:33this guy.2:16:33>> Oh my lord if my duty be too bold my2:16:36love is too unmanly.2:16:41>> I do not want to understand that. Will2:16:43you play upon this pipe?2:16:44>> My lord, I cannot. I pray you.2:16:46>> Believe me, I cannot. I do beseech you.2:16:48I know no touch of it, my lord.2:16:50>> This is as easy as lying. Govern these2:16:52ventages with your fingers and thumb.2:16:54Give it breath with your mouth. It will2:16:55discourse most eloquent music.2:16:59>> Look you, these are the stops.2:17:00>> These cannot I command to any utterance2:17:02of harmony. I have not the skill.2:17:07Why, look you now. How unworthy a thing2:17:10you make of me.2:17:14You'd play upon me.2:17:16You would seem to know my stops.2:17:19You would pluck out the heart of2:17:21mystery. You would sound me from my2:17:23lowest note to the top of my compass.2:17:25And there is much music. Excellent voice2:17:28in this little organ. Yeah. Cannot you2:17:31make it speak?2:17:34Do you see I am easier to be played on2:17:36than a pipe?2:17:39Call me what instrument you will. Though2:17:41you can threat me, you cannot play upon2:17:45me.2:17:48>> God bless you, sir.2:17:52>> My lord, the queen would speak with you.2:17:56>> He does. He's doing the the language,2:17:58but it sounds like it's just him2:18:00speaking.2:18:00>> Yeah.2:18:01>> Will you play upon this pipe? So, it's2:18:02excellent. It's very easy.2:18:04>> So, where is this from? This is2:18:06>> This is the Royal Shakespeare Company.2:18:08Okay.2:18:08>> So, this is a a stage play which is2:18:10recorded live,2:18:12>> not a film, but you can find the2:18:14recordings. This speech of his I've2:18:16always loved it. How he sets the trap2:18:18like you play this flute. I can't play.2:18:20It's so easy. You play it.2:18:22>> But you would play me.2:18:23>> You can't play this thing and you would2:18:25play me. So, I'm easier to play than a2:18:27flute.2:18:28>> Oh,2:18:28>> he traps the guy like that where the2:18:29guy's like, I can't play this, but you2:18:31would play me.2:18:33Like,2:18:34ah. So, yeah. I mean David Tenant also2:18:37just like god dear actor god dear2:18:42another book that I really really really2:18:44uh really moved me was Andre Agassi's2:18:47autobiography it's called open2:18:53when you you're reading something or2:18:55hearing someone and you feel like2:19:01>> it's incredible what he puts out there2:19:04like bro Are you sure you want to you2:19:06want to tell everyone this? Some things2:19:09it's okay if you2:19:11>> It's2:19:12utterly naked. That's why he's called it2:19:15open. He's taken out the most uh2:19:18painful,2:19:19the most hurtful, the most vulnerable2:19:22parts and say, and he's put it out2:19:27like it cannot help but but move you and2:19:30you feel you feel for him. You are. He2:19:33talks about the difficult relationship2:19:34that he has with tennis. When you2:19:36consider this guy is, you know, his name2:19:39is mentioned in the all-time great.2:19:41>> Yeah.2:19:41>> One of the greatest ever ever to play2:19:43tennis.2:19:43>> Yeah.2:19:45>> He hates tennis.2:19:48>> He talks about it in the thing. He's2:19:49saying, "I hate it. I hate the court. I2:19:51hate the ball. I hate the racket."2:19:54His father decided from before he was2:19:56born that he's going to be the greatest2:19:59tennis player. and his father then did2:20:02whatever it took to make him that. A lot2:20:05of that is very painful and very2:20:07difficult to read. And you see the2:20:08relationship that he has with it with2:20:10his father with the game of tennis. He's2:20:13so good at it. He's so amazing. He's2:20:16such an amazing player. But the feeling2:20:18that it makes him feel as he talks about2:20:21that it's it's heartbreaking.2:20:24>> This is considered one of the greatest2:20:25like autobiographies of because of the2:20:27openness which is there because tennis2:20:30Unlike any other sport,2:20:36it is you and your voices.2:20:38>> Yeah. So, I don't really watch sports. I2:20:41I don't enjoy watching sports. I've2:20:43never been into football or cricket or2:20:47tennis2:20:48because somehow tennis feels like you're2:20:51watching a human drama.2:20:52>> Yeah. M2:20:54>> even though they're on the court2:20:56playing, you get some close-up shots2:20:58where you get to see what's happening in2:21:00that person, you can't really see, but2:21:03you're coming close and you're you're2:21:04imagining and maybe projecting.2:21:07>> Yeah.2:21:08>> Uh tennis has like some human drama that2:21:12that always draws me in. Even though I2:21:15generally don't watch sports, when I2:21:17someone's watching tennis, I sit down, I2:21:18start watching the faces, watching the2:21:21people, and I get drawn in. And2:21:24like which is your first book reading2:21:26memory?2:21:27>> Enid Blightton.2:21:29>> I think I have written I have read2:21:33everything that Enid Blightton has ever2:21:35written. Uh I'll be open to uh to to2:21:39double check and and uh accept online2:21:42challenges.2:21:43>> Oh wow.2:21:44>> Uh I believe I've read everything that2:21:47she has ever written. Mallalerie Towers,2:21:50Secret Seven, Famous Five, Five Five2:21:52Findouters, Magic, Far Away Tree, No M.2:21:58Uh I I I would I would take the bet that2:22:00I've uh read everything Enid Blighton2:22:02ever wrote. That's my introduction to2:22:05reading.2:22:05>> And currently, do you get time to read2:22:07while listening to audio books?2:22:09Currently I have made it a conscious2:22:11effort to to go back uh to reading2:22:14because2:22:16we just start uh watching television uh2:22:19scrolling on the internet and we stop2:22:21reading books. Yeah.2:22:22>> So I make a conscious effort uh to to2:22:26read nowadays. Uh more so2:22:30I have found2:22:33but2:22:36I'm not so uh interested in fiction2:22:40anymore. Uh so I I I read non-fiction. I2:22:44read a lot of biographies and2:22:45autobiographies. Uh I love to read2:22:48history books. uh fiction somehow I2:22:51doesn't hold me anymore.2:22:53>> I try to read u uh fiction every now and2:22:56then because a friend of mine put it2:22:57very well. Friction sorry fiction gives2:22:59you empathy. It makes you more2:23:01empathetic if you read fiction. And I2:23:04recently read the Jealeri book Low Land2:23:08>> which I really really enjoyed and I2:23:10don't know I feel so accomplished after2:23:13finishing a fiction book2:23:16but curry and it just gives you so many2:23:19visuals right like it gives you like the2:23:21fantasy of it like I'm really into2:23:23sci-fi so I I have read a lot of Ray2:23:25Bradbury so images like I think in2:23:29general it makes you a more complete2:23:31person plus I also like a lot of non2:23:33nonfiction. I love self-help also.2:23:36Everyone hates self-help. I love2:23:37self-help.2:23:38>> Have you read uh the Leviathan's Wake2:23:41series? Uh2:23:42>> John Jonathan Levitan?2:23:44>> Uh no. The u the the book series which2:23:48The Expanse is based off of?2:23:50>> No. No, no, no, no, no.2:23:51>> Have you watched The Expanse?2:23:52>> I have watched the first episode. I2:23:54couldn't get into it.2:23:55>> You have to give it a little time. Huh?2:24:01It is some of the best sci-fi of the2:24:05modern era. So just for context, it's2:24:08actually written by a a a writing duo,2:24:11writing partners. They use the name2:24:13James SA Cory, but actually it's two2:24:15guys2:24:16uh who and again please internet correct2:24:19me if I'm wrong here, but uh they were2:24:22uh writing assistants to George RR2:24:24Martin. Oh,2:24:26>> so it's kind of his proteges.2:24:28Uh, so I when I'm trying to pitch2:24:31someone on expanse, I pitch it to them2:24:34as game of thrones in space.2:24:36>> Totally sold.2:24:37>> It's uh politics and different uh2:24:40different groups competing.2:24:42>> Huh.2:24:43>> Uh but it's really really good sci-fi.2:24:46Uh because the world building is2:24:48detailed and layered. Uh they so they've2:24:51put a lot of thought and effort into2:24:53fleshing out the world. the2:24:56socopolitical2:24:58layers that they're looking at because2:24:59any good sci-fi you want to also use it2:25:01to as a lens to look at our world.2:25:03>> Yeah.2:25:04>> War is the wrong place for good men.2:25:07>> Good or bad, it's the same place for2:25:09everyone.2:25:10>> That is also really interesting in in2:25:12expanse. So I highly recommend the show.2:25:14Uh I have not read the books but my2:25:17friends who have read them also love2:25:19them very much and there are more books2:25:21than seasons of the show.2:25:22>> Have you read 1984? Yes, I have.2:25:25>> Yeah, I love everything of that2:25:27universe. The the book of 1984, the2:25:30movies. There are two or three 19842:25:32movies.2:25:32>> Yeah, I've seen the original with John2:25:35Hurt was in it.2:25:35>> And I think one 1984 came in the year2:25:381984.2:25:40>> That's the one with John Hurt.2:25:41>> Yeah. And I love that. I think 1953 or2:25:45something also there was a 1984 that2:25:47came in. And there is a audio book on2:25:49audible of 1984 which has Andrew2:25:52Garfield and Andrew Scott and [snorts]2:25:55it's a beautiful audio book. They have2:25:57just done the whole book as a audio2:25:59spectacle. There will be no loyalty2:26:02except loyalty to the party. There will2:26:04be no love except for the love of big2:26:08brother. [sighs]2:26:10>> I love Julia. I only love Julia. You2:26:13can't stop that.2:26:14>> There's another book which came out now.2:26:16Can you please check the name of the2:26:17whistleblower from Meta? Careless2:26:20people.2:26:20>> Careless people. Yeah.2:26:21>> Yeah.2:26:21>> It's a wild read.2:26:23>> Oh, you have read it. How is it like2:26:24>> it's it's it is an excellent uh it's2:26:27it's it's very tasty.2:26:30>> But if you sp so you spend a bit of time2:26:34reading this and watching some2:26:35interviews about these guys. So much of2:26:37our lives today is governed by a few of2:26:41these people. A few tech billionaires2:26:44who control the algorithms who control2:26:47the way that we communicate with one2:26:49another. The way that our commerce2:26:51happens. How much stuff happens through2:26:53your cell phone. Your banking happens2:26:55through your phone. You're paying a guy2:26:56over here. Your transport is happening.2:26:58>> Yeah.2:26:59>> Everything is going through this. All of2:27:02that traffic, everything that you are2:27:04doing is also nudged and manipulated.2:27:07Whichever app you open, they are the2:27:08gatekeepers. They get to choose and and2:27:10show you certain stuff. You're thinking2:27:12it's a democrat uh it's a completely2:27:14democratic process. It's not. The2:27:16algorithm determines what is sent to you2:27:18first, what price you are given. You2:27:20open your Uber app, I open my Uber app,2:27:22you have an Android phone, I have an2:27:24iPhone. They'll charge us differently.2:27:26So that algorithm based pricing is to2:27:30extract more money from me and extract2:27:33more money from the driver between me2:27:35and the cab driver. What actually should2:27:37be I give my money to him.2:27:39>> The algorithm is trying to figure how2:27:41can I get more money which which user2:27:44which driver how do I game this system2:27:46to get an extra two bucks out of you and2:27:49give two bucks less to that that driver.2:27:51>> There's a book I recommended recently.2:27:54It's an audio book I listened to. It's2:27:55called technofudalism.2:27:57>> Yes. Yes. I've I I've been pitching this2:28:00book to everyone. Janice Vufakis. Huh.2:28:02>> Oh yes. Janis. Yeah.2:28:04>> Technofudalism. Exactly. He's he's2:28:07describing and defining our modern2:28:09system. Here is our dystopia. It is2:28:12technofudalism.2:28:14It is a system where none of us own2:28:16anything. All of us exist to generate2:28:19value for a few while continuing to2:28:22>> for a few feudal lords. Yeah. while2:28:24consuming. So you stay on the treadmill,2:28:26you keep running, keep running, keep2:28:27running.2:28:28>> Yeah.2:28:28>> To run their company, to make more. You2:28:30get just enough tokens to pay for this2:28:33month's shelter, this month's food, and2:28:35a little entertainment, and you go back.2:28:37>> That is the system that they want. You2:28:39will own nothing.2:28:40>> Yeah. I don't know if you are into2:28:42gaming, but uh Sony just said2:28:44PlayStation.2:28:47>> That is what So this is what they're all2:28:48moving towards. the fact that you have2:28:50paid money. If you have been paying a2:28:53subscription to listen to music over the2:28:56years, how many thousands, tens of2:28:58thousands of rupees you must have paid2:29:00to a music subscription.2:29:02One day they can say, "Acha, this artist2:29:04is no longer there. We don't have the2:29:06licensing rights. So I've paid you2:29:0810,000 rupees over the years, but I2:29:10can't listen to this one song."2:29:11>> I am really into dystopia because this2:29:14is a question I'm interested in. What do2:29:16you think will be the future of the2:29:18universe? like what dystopia are we2:29:20going to go into? Will we run out of2:29:22food? Will we run out of water? Will2:29:23aliens come in? Will there be fertility2:29:25issues? Because every filmmaker has2:29:27their own vision of dystopia. What kind2:29:30of dystopia do you think we will go2:29:33into?2:29:34>> We are there2:29:37uh I believe as I as we look around the2:29:39world 2026. Yeah. [laughter] I think uh2:29:44because in any of these dystopic views2:29:48any ones that are being a little2:29:50authentic they do also look at the2:29:52divide and the separation between the2:29:54halves and the have nots. You think of2:29:55you know Ellesium or2:29:58>> any of these you see that there is a2:30:00certain group of people who are2:30:03insulated from it. uh at in Wall-E.2:30:07>> Yeah.2:30:07>> Uh there are the people in their2:30:09floating chairs and2:30:10>> yeah, everyone is obese.2:30:12>> That's who we are now.2:30:14>> We most of us uh I I I and I single2:30:18myself out here and anyone who lives a2:30:20life of the comfort and privilege that I2:30:22do is one of those obese people in the2:30:25floating chair because we know what the2:30:27reality of the rest of you you don't2:30:30have to look far. you have to, you know,2:30:33slow down at a traffic light in the in2:30:35our own city and you see people who live2:30:38on the street, children in gutters. This2:30:41is this is the dystopia. We're already2:30:44there. Uh it's just those of us who are2:30:47shielded from it2:30:50uh feel that our world is still okay.2:30:53We're envisioning a horrible future2:30:55where we don't have what we have.2:30:58But if we didn't live where we live in2:30:59society, if I didn't live where I lived,2:31:02if I lived on the street, that's that's2:31:04that is our modern dystopia. We're2:31:06there. Just some of us have it better2:31:08than others.2:31:11>> Sorry, it's a downer.2:31:13>> No, no,2:31:16>> but my2:31:21my my my optimism uh levels are, I2:31:24think, at a historic low. And maybe I'm2:31:27not alone in this you know maybe uh2:31:29maybe a lot of people around there2:31:31around us today surely you have hearing2:31:34this in your friend group uh and and uh2:31:37around in the online chatter2:31:41everyone seems to have uh this this2:31:44sense of impending doom. It feels like2:31:46things are getting worse have gotten2:31:49worse. the idea that we that there is a2:31:52good future ahead of us.2:31:55Nobody believes that anymore.2:31:56>> Yeah.2:31:57>> You know, there was a time2:32:0015 years ago, 20 years ago, 30 years ago2:32:03when the general societal perception was2:32:07that we were moving towards something2:32:09better. You ask most people like okay2:32:11there are problems but tomorrow will be2:32:13better. M2:32:15>> I think we're at a time now where2:32:19everyone or the collective majority2:32:21feels that tomorrow will be worse than2:32:23today.2:32:24>> Yeah.2:32:24>> There is no longer a sense that there is2:32:26a better tomorrow.2:32:28>> Hence the question, what kind of2:32:29dystopia do you choose? Dystopia.2:32:32[laughter]2:32:32Yeah.2:32:33>> Yeah. Yeah. the the the the ones that2:32:35come closest to it, I think, are2:32:39uh [sighs] the the the the cyberpunk2:32:41dystopia, the the the world of of of2:32:44Bladeunner and uh District District 9.2:32:48>> Yeah.2:32:49>> Uh that that that part of it where the2:32:54world is in economic and ecological2:32:57collapse. Sound familiar?2:32:59>> Mhm.2:33:01But uh a select group of elites2:33:05uh consume more than their fair share of2:33:07resources and are shielded from the2:33:10realities by technology.2:33:13That's where we are going. We're going2:33:16to Elisium.2:33:18But we're there basically2:33:21because if you live in a comfortable2:33:22high-rise today, you know, you're in a2:33:24gated community, you're in one of these2:33:26modern buildings that has its own2:33:27swimming pool, its own health club, it's2:33:29got an indoor basketball court, and your2:33:33apartment is temperature controlled,2:33:35humidity controlled.2:33:38Money and technology has shielded you2:33:39from you're in a you're living in a2:33:41spaceship basically.2:33:43That's how we live in the city now. We2:33:45live from one air conditioner to the2:33:47other2:33:51moment without the air conditioner. That2:33:53is where otherwise everything is2:33:55actually a spaceship.2:33:56>> Yeah, it is because now not even air2:33:59conditioners but the other thing that2:34:01has become the norm. People have air2:34:04purifiers.2:34:06So it's like a submarine that or or a2:34:08spaceship that you're living in there.2:34:10You're cooling the air, you are2:34:11purifying the air, you are adjusting the2:34:13lights, you're shutting out the outside2:34:14world. So also it is with your car. So2:34:17those of us who live in these2:34:19environments, we are using money and2:34:22technology to separate ourselves from2:34:24the harsh reality of the actual world.2:34:27The dystopia is upon us. We are there.2:34:30It's just we we are the ones who are who2:34:33are shielded right now. And it's2:34:34interesting that you mentioned Wall-E2:34:36because I think waste is going to become2:34:38a very big problem and the way they had2:34:40showcased like how we had to almost2:34:42leave the planet and the waste was all2:34:44there and Wally is taking care of it.2:34:46That is going to be something.2:34:47>> Everything about Wally is absolutely2:34:49bang on authentic with the sole2:34:51exception of all of humanity leaving the2:34:52planet.2:34:53>> Aa you think we'll still be here with2:34:55all those problems?2:34:582/3 of the planet is water, right?2:35:01Famously, and one/ird is land. Why do we2:35:05not live on two/3s of the planet?2:35:08It's too difficult. It's complicated. We2:35:09can't.2:35:11If we cannot live on water on our own2:35:13planet, the idea that we are going to go2:35:14and live on another planet, Mars,2:35:19you can't live in a submarine out at sea2:35:22indefinitely.2:35:23>> That's still on our own planet. On Mars,2:35:26you would have to have habitats that are2:35:29running.2:35:31The whole the idea that all of humanity2:35:33will up and go. We can do small small2:35:35scale space travel. But another big2:35:38problem in future that I think is going2:35:41to be people impersonating you because2:35:43of AI and imagine my mom.2:35:50Imagine my mom getting a call from web2:35:52hub key. I've run out of money. Can you2:35:54transfer me five lakh rupees with my2:35:57face with my audio which is not me?2:36:00Soon.2:36:05So every family needs to have a secret2:36:08code.2:36:19Sin I am all about2:36:22secret codes and2:36:24>> what's code and2:36:25>> all all of the thing [snorts]2:36:27there there is one little thread of2:36:28paranoia somewhere in my heart.2:36:31>> Ah2:36:32plan for that situation2:36:35who knows what the situation will be but2:36:38the day something goes wrong have a2:36:40backup plan.2:36:41>> Have you watched threebody problem?2:36:43>> Yeah quite enjoyable.2:36:46>> Uh I've not read the books. I'm yeah I'm2:36:48a big fan of the books.2:36:49>> Uh I as I understand it in the show2:36:52they've really condensed and skipped2:36:54through a lot of it.2:36:55>> I didn't watch the show only because I2:36:57love the books so much.2:36:58>> Huh. So it was a cool concept but the2:37:03Netflix approach to making shows2:37:08>> their adaptation of pre-existing2:37:10properties and the way they treat their2:37:11original properties also is sketch2:37:14>> and everything has a Netflix aesthetic2:37:17and which is consistent and everything2:37:19which is not a very good thing.2:37:21>> Yeah. individuality shows or films2:37:26or like which is I think a very big2:37:28problem and more so I think in Indian2:37:30landscape2:37:32>> like Netflix still we they gave us2:37:34adolescence2:37:37but that is not a it's it is a yes and a2:37:41no it's and every every so often they'll2:37:44acquire a prestige project but it's not2:37:47entirely made inhouse because2:37:50Uh I don't know if you watched u uh this2:37:54interview that Ben Affleck and Matt2:37:56Damon did with Joe Rogan2:37:57>> with Rogan where they're talking about2:38:00the process2:38:01>> uh of2:38:03delivering uh content that that they2:38:07wanted to align with the algorithm.2:38:09>> And you know it wouldn't be terrible if2:38:10you reiterated the plot three or four2:38:13times in the dialogue because people are2:38:15on their phones while they're watching.2:38:16[laughter] You know what I mean? And so2:38:18then it's going to really start to imp2:38:20>> and what it means is you get more and2:38:23more stuff that feels similar2:38:27because you're trying to create an2:38:29average like from these 10 films we had2:38:32this average learning in average2:38:37then in average average average2:38:42moving outwards so that your narratives2:38:45this you get something that seems seems2:38:48familiar.2:38:48>> Yeah, I can imagine like conference2:38:50rooms where someone stands and says we2:38:52need a jenzi2:38:55who is going to make it2:39:00you know that is still uh that that was2:39:03a a process even before the algorithm2:39:05but at least it was a singular uh point2:39:09where you you are trying to do a a2:39:12singular point thing. The algorithm2:39:15wants your your narrative or your2:39:18content to match other stuff. I have2:39:21enough enough friends, enough people who2:39:23are working surely you have also heard2:39:25enough stories2:39:27that over the course of a of a project2:39:31uh whatever newest data comes in they2:39:34will keep trying to make it align with2:39:35that. So now you've written a script and2:39:38you are halfway through filming.2:39:41New data came in last week and that new2:39:43data says this is can you make your film2:39:45align with this?2:39:48You can't.2:39:50So uh it it is a constant uh constant2:39:54adjustment2:39:56trying to be more average because the2:39:59average line like if this is the average2:40:01then just line up with this.2:40:04So yeah, you're not even trying to do a2:40:06single point2:40:09to use your example. You're trying to2:40:12make every film more like every other2:40:14film.2:40:18A little bit more of that, little bit2:40:19more of that. So everything is average.2:40:22There was this thing nature versus2:40:24nurture was always a debate. Now it is2:40:26nature, nurture and algorithm.2:40:29You're not just like uh trained and2:40:32created by nature and nurture. It's also2:40:34the algorithm.2:40:34>> It is. It is very much2:40:38and I2:40:40at least I am perceiving that there is2:40:43also a little algorithm fatigue2:40:46>> 100%2:40:46>> that everyone is feeling like somehow2:40:50there is too much of everything but yet2:40:53none none of it sticks. It's like there2:40:56is a massive river going past but you2:40:59never want to slow down and look at any2:41:01of it2:41:02>> and it's really really hampering the2:41:05mental health of people to an extent2:41:07where they have no idea. It's like '7s2:41:1080s cigarettes2:41:17damage was done. So I read a very2:41:20interesting book title is flashy your2:41:25brain on porn. So uh that is a book I2:41:29would recommend to everyone. It is just2:41:31about the over stimulation we are living2:41:33in right now and why people don't2:41:36understand how big of a problem porn is2:41:44the modern media landscape. All of us2:41:47are over stimulated. There is too much2:41:50coming at us uh more than we are capable2:41:55of of processing. Just mentally we2:41:57cannot digest and process so much data,2:42:00so much information, so much2:42:02stimulation.2:42:03>> People are overstimulated and exhausted2:42:06and stressed. We all feel it. Uh we2:42:09don't pause for a second to question2:42:14the2:42:16All of the systems out there, they are2:42:19manipulative, exploitative2:42:22and all of us have just normalized them.2:42:26Do you ever stop to consider2:42:28uh you use Uber auto.2:42:34I live in Bombay. There's an auto driver2:42:39where you step out onto the road. You2:42:40say2:42:42beach. He goes to Juu beach and you give2:42:45him uh money and this is the system.2:42:51Now you have a third party who is2:42:54entered into this who is Uber who are an2:42:57American corporation.2:43:00The system is going via the cell phone.2:43:01I'm buying an Apple cell phone. I'm2:43:03giving money for my data streaming. All2:43:05of this. So it all of these other people2:43:08are piggybacking off of this. And now on2:43:11on this one ride, I'm a Bombay guy. This2:43:13auto ricksha guy is a is a Bombay guy.2:43:15We go to Juu beach. A percentage of that2:43:17money is going to an American2:43:19corporation who is also harvesting our2:43:22data and selling our data onto the side.2:43:24They step into the system. They upend2:43:26the system. They take a percentage of of2:43:28the thing and they're also spying on you2:43:31and and selling your data to to2:43:32advertisers down the line.2:43:35>> It's crazy that all these guys are doing2:43:37this stuff that it's all normalized. You2:43:38know, one one actor who speaks a lot2:43:41about the harms of social media very2:43:44like publicly is Joseph Gordon Levit.2:43:47>> I love that guy.2:43:48>> Yeah, he's and he's especially talking2:43:50about the harm of social media to2:43:52children like2:43:59you need to stop and see how it is2:44:01harming the kids. all of these systems2:44:03and I've every so often I will see like2:44:07an interview or a video of his pop up2:44:08where he's talking about the thing,2:44:10addressing the thing.2:44:11>> And look, social media can be so great2:44:13and continues to be so great, but there2:44:15are all these damaging side effects.2:44:16There's a a global crisis and mental2:44:18health and loneliness. There's a rise in2:44:20polarization, extremism. he was doing2:44:22something where he was talking to uh2:44:26politicians and lawmakers trying to get2:44:29uh legislature to address this. So I2:44:34really appreciate the fact that he's2:44:36he's doing this thing that he's using2:44:38his voice and platform uh to address2:44:41this. A lot of us need to the thing is2:44:44we've as I say we have all normalized uh2:44:47a lot of these systems and a lot of us2:44:50are invested in these systems and we2:44:52depend on them for our livelihood.2:44:57So it then becomes even more complicated2:44:59to address the thing.2:45:01>> Yeah.2:45:01>> You know uh everyone makes money off of2:45:05Instagram.2:45:07Uh but there is so much about Instagram2:45:09that is known to us uh that that has2:45:11come out from whistleblowers. The fact2:45:14that uh2:45:16uh meta engineers would actively uh be2:45:19able to tell when people are feeling2:45:22vulnerable, feeling depressed,2:45:23particularly uh teenage girls and they2:45:26would then push content on them that is2:45:28manipulative, exploitative. All of this2:45:31is stuff that they know and they will2:45:32take advantage of. Where is Janitu Jana2:45:36right now on the internet? Is it on any2:45:38OTT?2:45:38>> Uh Janitu is not on any OTT. Uh2:45:42>> so2:45:44[laughter]2:45:45again and not in my hands. This this is2:45:48Amir Khan Productions.2:45:50>> At some point AK pulled the films off uh2:45:53off streaming2:45:55uh and there has never been a since2:45:58then. It's it's been a couple of years2:46:00now. We've never there's never been a2:46:02proper agreement uh to license the films2:46:04anywhere.2:46:05>> But like Satare did come out on Sony.2:46:07No.2:46:08>> Uh only that one. But if you try to find2:46:11Delhi belly or you try to find Janetu,2:46:16try to find Lagan2:46:19cannot find them.2:46:20>> Why?2:46:21>> Because they're not on. No, but like why2:46:23is he not want like2:46:26>> uh so famously during the release of2:46:28Satar Zamipar uh he had uh he was2:46:31actively seeking to push back against2:46:34streaming.2:46:35Uh now so this is a whole larger uh2:46:38conversation and debate that is also uh2:46:41its own in a little interesting rabbit2:46:42hole which is the hold out of cinemas2:46:46against streaming.2:46:49>> Okay. So, uh, uh, cinemas and box office2:46:53are kind of in a battle for their own2:46:54survival. Uh, and streaming has in2:46:58recent years taken a big bite out of2:47:00that.2:47:02>> Uh, and2:47:05you know, it's hard to I I don't want to2:47:08say that someone is right, someone is2:47:09wrong. It's there are ideological2:47:11stances. There are talks of2:47:13democratization of the process,2:47:16opening up of you know uh uh gates that2:47:20were earlier closed whatever whatever so2:47:24you can't say that it's strongly in2:47:25favor of one or against the other.2:47:27Theatrical business is great streaming2:47:29is also great. While releasing Sitar, AK2:47:31was wanting to uh protect theatrical2:47:35business and push back against uh2:47:38streaming which he saw as taking a2:47:41significant bite out of the theatrical2:47:43revenue.2:47:44>> Okay.2:47:45>> And again the the merits uh and pros and2:47:48cons of this of this viewpoint and2:47:50strategy are endlessly open to debate.2:47:54But that is how the how it arrived at2:47:56that where he was seeking to push back2:47:59against streaming seeking to uh defend2:48:02the theatrical business and for that2:48:04reason he was not wanting for his films2:48:07to be available on streaming as I say2:48:10the the actual merits of of the thing2:48:14who can say uh2:48:17but what what we do have is a situation2:48:20where none of these films are available2:48:21for viewing. People keep asking me, hey,2:48:23I want to watch Delhi belly. How can I2:48:24watch it?2:48:26You'll have to sail the high seas.2:48:28Niharti, [laughter]2:48:30>> you know, I I have one video uh on the2:48:34EKP YouTube channel where I am2:48:36interviewing Ashtoh Gowarakar and we are2:48:38talking about Lagan. So, it was very2:48:41>> was this for the Lagan uh 20th2:48:43anniversary?2:48:44>> Yeah, but like we recorded it sometime2:48:46last year. We recorded three or four2:48:47bits. So it's just us nerding out on the2:48:49opening scene of Lagan and talking about2:48:51different different aspects of Lagan.2:48:53>> Audiences are very welcoming. They want2:48:55the filmmaker to manipulate them. So in2:48:57a way it can be said if you can take2:48:59care of them, audiences are willing to2:49:01submit to the filmmaker.2:49:02>> Absolutely.2:49:03>> There is a book that I think got me into2:49:07the world of films and film making which2:49:09is the autobiography of Robert Rodri2:49:12Rodriguez.2:49:13>> Rebel Without a Crew.2:49:14>> Rebel Without a Crew.2:49:15>> Yeah. Bro, that's such a great book.2:49:17>> Great book. And I also have a real soft2:49:21spot in my heart for Robert Rodriguez.2:49:23>> Yeah.2:49:24>> Uh because this guy also2:49:28uh stepped out of the mainstream,2:49:31stepped out of the Hollywood studio2:49:32system and said, "Yeah,2:49:36>> yeah."2:49:36>> And he has been making films2:49:40outside of the system. Sometimes they're2:49:42weird, sometimes they're janky.2:49:45And what I realized, what I hadn't fully2:49:48realized back then, but watching his2:49:50films as an adult, I started showing Spy2:49:53Kids to to my daughter and I like2:49:56positive film2:49:59gender representation balanced people of2:50:02color, you know, all of these layers.2:50:06It was a very uh progressive film2:50:08progressive film2:50:09>> in and it had like really positive2:50:12messaging throughout. There is a a2:50:14little emotionality again of you know2:50:16family familial bonds2:50:18>> keeping a family together that's2:50:20difficult2:50:22>> and that's the mission worth fighting2:50:24for.2:50:25>> So watching his films with a slightly2:50:28more grown-up lens I was like ar this is2:50:30because somewhere I thought Desperado is2:50:32is the film that made me a fan which is2:50:35a wildly over the top action film2:50:38>> for the maker of that to then turn2:50:39around and start making films with2:50:41heart. I'm also a big fan of the Spike2:50:44films and the tonality of it or just2:50:46fight scenes where you like sit on the2:50:48robots. I think it's in Spike 3D 3D2:50:52>> and uh I just bought everything2:50:57and I'm like I am just loving every2:50:59moment of it and I realized it much2:51:00later that it is made by Robert2:51:02Rodriguez. So this is also thing I love.2:51:09This I was such a big Linklitter fan. I2:51:12realized it much later that there is2:51:13another film that I like called School2:51:15of Rock School of Rock2:51:16>> which is made by Linklitter. It's such2:51:18an unlike Linklitter film2:51:20>> but such a complete film. You watch it2:51:22anytime and you'll feel better. Uh2:51:25Rodriguez made another good film which2:51:27sadly didn't uh didn't click at the box2:51:30office called Alita Battle Angel2:51:32produced by James Cameron.2:51:34>> Whoa.2:51:35>> So it's a it's originally a manga2:51:37series.2:51:38Uh so it's a it's a manga anime that had2:51:41its own fan following. Cameron was2:51:44developing the project uh and he was2:51:47developing it for a long time. And as he2:51:50tells it, they reached a point where2:51:53they were developing the technology and2:51:55he was doing simultaneous tests for2:51:58Alita and for Avatar.2:52:00>> And just the way the technology was2:52:02developing, he's like avatar.2:52:05So he let Alita sit and he went into2:52:08Avatar and we know how that turned out.2:52:09>> Yeah. But because Alita was a a property2:52:13that had been developing and has its own2:52:15fan following,2:52:17Robert Rodriguez one day bumps into2:52:19Cameron somewhere and asked him sir2:52:24and2:52:25you know it's a I really like it but I'm2:52:28very busy with AVA part one2:52:33so I don't have time for Alita. Are you2:52:36interested? Robert says yes I'm I'm into2:52:38it. So he came on. So they got all of2:52:41the tech that was developed for Avdar2:52:44that then spun off into Alita2:52:47>> directed by Rodriguez.2:52:49So it's a really lovely film. Again,2:52:51it's got heart, it's got soul and2:52:54amazing effects.2:52:55>> So the thing is I don't like consider2:52:59Robert Rodriguez as a very great2:53:02filmmaker, but I'm just in awe of the2:53:05conviction he has for the films he2:53:07makes.2:53:08>> Yeah. and he consistently brings in an2:53:11emotional core.2:53:12>> Yeah.2:53:13>> That I appreciate and that a lot of2:53:16other filmmakers just don't.2:53:19So the fact that he tries and he intends2:53:22to do that and successfully does it.2:53:24There are there are moments of true2:53:26emotionality, vulnerability.2:53:29>> Yeah.2:53:29>> Uh just just heartfelt moments in his2:53:32films in Alita as well.2:53:33>> I have a question related to this. So2:53:36>> like you mentioned that you were2:53:37connected to Robert's sister's journey.2:53:40So there are filmmakers who work in like2:53:42independent budgets and then suddenly2:53:44they get a blank check film that now you2:53:48get all the resources now you can make2:53:50whatever film you want like the Odyssey2:53:51is a blank check film for new. So do you2:53:54have any like films in this space like2:53:57when a filmmaker got like the maximum2:53:59resources and they did whatever they2:54:01wanted2:54:04>> which is a really good one.2:54:09>> It is generally rare2:54:13uh for a filmmaker to2:54:17step up. A lot of filmmakers when they2:54:20are when they have no no budget they2:54:23make really great stuff and the day that2:54:25they get a big budget that film2:54:28>> tends to tends to stumble and fall.2:54:31>> Uh with Rodriguez it was Once Upon a2:54:34Time in Mexico2:54:35>> because Desperado2:54:37was also a remake of El Mariachi. So El2:54:39Mariachi was2:54:42>> great fun but very kacha. They gave him2:54:45$20 and said, "Ch, go and make2:54:48Desperado."2:54:49>> Yeah.2:54:50>> All time classic. That was amazing. They2:54:53said, "Here, take 20 million, go and2:54:54make Once Upon a Time in Mexico." That2:54:56didn't work out so well.2:54:58>> Who has done really well once you gave2:55:00them a proper budget?2:55:01>> Who is that mumble guy? Dakota Johnson.2:55:08>> Cooper Indie. Then Dakota Johnson's team2:55:12approached him2:55:19film called House. Um and then uh2:55:23he made this film called Chacha Real2:55:26Smooth Real Smooth.2:55:27>> This is on Apple TV.2:55:28>> I watched it. I didn't really get into2:55:30it.2:55:31>> So2:55:33I think it's liked by people.2:55:39It's a very interesting indie film. Very2:55:42confident indie film.2:55:44>> Something about Chaa Real Smooth I2:55:46wasn't getting into it. It was feeling2:55:47like TV. There is something about2:55:50framing and it's you know even just uh a2:55:53dialogue scene there's a way of setting2:55:55up and shooting where it feels cinematic2:56:00and there is a way where and I it even2:56:04as someone who does who works2:56:05professionally within the industry it's2:56:08it's hard to put your finger on2:56:10sometimes it just feels like TV and2:56:14sometimes it feels cinematic chacha real2:56:16smooths felt like that2:56:17>> I think the problem is Dakota Johnson.2:56:20I'm [laughter] just a lot of times she2:56:22is2:56:24>> the It's the director's What are you2:56:26setting?2:56:27>> I'm just kidding.2:56:27>> Like last night I watched Obsession,2:56:29which uh have you seen it by the way?2:56:31>> Yeah, I love it.2:56:33>> It's made for no money, but it feels2:56:36cinematic. Every shot, every frame,2:56:40it never feels low budget.2:56:42>> Where did you watch it?2:56:43>> Uh I downloaded it.2:56:47proper.2:56:49Yeah, becauseensored2:56:52anything that's gone through the2:56:53censorship process and2:56:56>> uh so yeah so in its entirety but it2:57:00feels so cinematic and it's made by a2:57:0325year-old kid. This guy's 25 years old.2:57:06They've made it for whatever money was2:57:09found, you know, in in between the the2:57:11sofa cushions like2:57:14>> and they have a very interesting journey2:57:16because they are YouTubers. Karib Baka2:57:18is a YouTuber.2:57:20>> Yeah.2:57:20>> And he used to make a lot of YouTube2:57:22films before this and he used to do all2:57:24these sketches.2:57:25>> Doom part 2 was the best movie of all2:57:26time.2:57:27>> I'm a lie detector, man. I'm a I'm a2:57:30human lie detector. I've always been.2:57:32>> No, no, no, no, no. So suddenly with2:57:35Kane Parsons and him Kane Parsons with2:57:37back rooms and him they are just like2:57:40going to overtake like they're going to2:57:42rule Hollywood at least it seems like2:57:44that and I love the actress also of2:57:46obsession indie what's her name Indian2:57:48never2:57:49>> Indian2:57:51>> amazing performance amazing2:57:54>> I'm your freaky Nikki2:57:55>> I was so impressed with the film all the2:57:58way like cinematography production2:58:01design great actors director's craft. It2:58:05it's it's genuinely been a while since I2:58:08watched a film where I was2:58:13cheering on all department. I think all2:58:15of you people have done such great work.2:58:17>> Yeah,2:58:20because it was a massive hit in India.2:58:23Everyone was2:58:24>> hugely popular.2:58:25>> Yeah,2:58:26>> correctly. So, correctly so.2:58:28>> It it it is genuinely that good. These2:58:31people are very very talented. That girl2:58:35is incredible to pull off a performance2:58:38like that.2:58:39>> Do you know she's also YouTube live2:58:41streamer where she would play these2:58:43games Last of Us and all2:58:45>> key generation every2:58:49is where they're coming from. uh you2:58:52know we we we tend to look at this from2:58:55the old school that uh there is you know2:58:58cinema which is you know for purists and2:59:01all2:59:03generation video games and YouTube and2:59:05all but this is where the next2:59:07generation of crafts people of makers2:59:09are coming from2:59:10>> yeah2:59:12everyone will be a streamer and a2:59:14YouTuber genre2:59:17being a film person it's like films2:59:18about films2:59:19>> yeah I I love it too.2:59:20>> Check out this film uh I think it's2:59:23again 1995 called Living in Oblivion.2:59:25>> I haven't seen like2:59:26>> Steve Bushi is a director2:59:30trying to make an independent film2:59:32>> in the film.2:59:33>> Oh wow.2:59:34>> And it's so it's like the struggle of an2:59:37independent filmmaker.2:59:38>> Sometimes I wonder what the hell I'm2:59:39doing in this business. [snorts]2:59:41>> It's all just one compromise and2:59:43disappointment after another.2:59:45>> State and Maine directed by David2:59:46Mamemoth. So love David Mamemoth. Uh2:59:51this is a film about a film crew. So2:59:54there's one small town and a film crew2:59:56arrives in the small town to make a film2:59:59and how these filmy people take over the3:00:02town. It's a kind of a loving takedown3:00:05of you know film that film people only3:00:08care about the film and everything else3:00:12is just a resource and a commodity.3:00:14>> You cannot lose the shot. The meaning of3:00:16the film is in that shot.3:00:18>> But Wally, the window to the fire,3:00:19>> I don't care. Fix it.3:00:21>> So, it's a it's a great satirical3:00:23takedown of of that. What happens when a3:00:26self-absorbed film unit arrives in a3:00:29small town or small town life gets3:00:31completely upended.3:00:32>> This also has Philip Seymour.3:00:34>> Yeah, he's great in it. He is the3:00:36idealistic writer3:00:39film and he is there like with all3:00:42idealism watching how Hollywood is3:00:44turning his film into3:00:46>> Yeah.3:00:46>> So they're like3:00:48love scene he's like but why he's like3:00:52see for this is all so the whole process3:00:56of3:00:57uh an idealistic writer seeing what is3:01:00happening to his film.3:01:01>> We can't shoot the old mill. You know,3:01:04they told me there were going to be3:01:05jokes. Should I kid the kid the new guy?3:01:07>> That's not quite it.3:01:08>> The old mill burnt down.3:01:10>> Seeing how the thing gets changed and3:01:12adjusted basis,3:01:16so we can't do that. It's It's great fun3:01:19and it completely satizes the business.3:01:23>> Yeah. I'm thinking of more films on3:01:25films.3:01:26>> Babylon underrated.3:01:27>> Babylon.3:01:29>> It flopped and like everyone trashed it.3:01:32I loved it because it felt insane. It3:01:36felt like what movie making is actually3:01:39like.3:01:39>> What happens up on that screen means3:01:42something. Maybe not to you in your3:01:44ivory tower,3:01:46but for real people on the ground, it3:01:49means something.3:01:51>> Most people didn't uh appreciate her or3:01:54speak well of it.3:01:56I was staggered at3:01:58>> but every caphile I know of really loved3:02:01the film. Like people who love films3:02:04loved Babylon.3:02:05>> It gave you the feeling of what making3:02:08movies is like.3:02:09>> Yeah.3:02:10>> There is like a an insanity3:02:13and a and a a mad passion to it.3:02:16>> Have you seen the studio?3:02:17>> I gave up halfway because3:02:20percussion and Birdman.3:02:23[laughter] We watched Birdman. You3:02:24watched three, four episodes of the3:02:26studio. Now every episode is following3:02:28that same floating camera and doo that3:02:30percussive background.3:02:31>> No, I get what you're saying.3:02:33>> So it was I was enjoying parts of it. I3:02:36was like up.3:02:37>> I'm a big fan of Entourage. Have you3:02:40seen Entourage? The show3:02:41>> again a few seasons back then but as it3:02:44got longer. So my you are not into TV3:02:48shows that much3:02:49>> because at some point I'm like3:02:5510 hours 20 hours 30 hours with this3:02:57thing now like it's enough cuz even like3:03:00Lord of the Rings is still only like 7 83:03:03hours long3:03:04>> here entourage3:03:07at some point I my investment passes3:03:11[clears throat] that's enough now new3:03:13characters new world some other3:03:16So I uh this is what keeps me from3:03:19following series long term. After a3:03:22couple of seasons of a of a series, my3:03:26my investment drops out.3:03:28>> Which is your favorite Robin film?3:03:30>> The Princess Bride. This is probably my3:03:34favorite film in the universe.3:03:36>> Acha.3:03:36>> I watch it multiple times in a year.3:03:38>> Can you move at all?3:03:40>> Move? You're alive.3:03:43If you want, I can fly.3:03:46>> It has this3:03:48this romance and this beauty and this3:03:50there there's some some heart in it.3:03:52There's an idealism in it. It keeps3:03:54something alive in me. Some some3:03:57idealistic uh pure inner child part.3:04:02That film does that for me. It it keeps3:04:05something alive inside.3:04:06>> Which is your favorite Amir Khan film?3:04:09It's kind of between uh Lagan and Rang3:04:13Basanti. For me, these are the the the3:04:16the two uh best films that he has uh3:04:20that he has made. Lagan is very3:04:23classical. It's like a classic3:04:25old-fashioned epic in the style of3:04:28Cholay or Lawrence of Arabia, Gladiator,3:04:32you know, like a classical epic.3:04:35Uh, and it's it's just masterfully3:04:39executed. The the the scale of task that3:04:42these guys had and how they put that3:04:44film together. You must have seen the3:04:45documentary.3:04:46>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Madness in Desert.3:04:48>> Madness in the Desert.3:04:49>> Yeah.3:04:50>> It's it was an awesome undertaking and3:04:55you know cinema is forever once you once3:04:56you commit something to celluloid.3:04:59Lagan is one for the ages. Madness and3:05:02desert be I think burdens or dream of3:05:04dreams or category like hearts of3:05:07darkness. Yeah.3:05:09>> Because famously the first cut of Lagan3:05:11was 7 hours long or some3:05:14>> insane.3:05:15>> I want to do some uh uh miscellaneous3:05:18questions with you. Now uh which is a3:05:22product that you purchased for less than3:05:2410,000 rupees that you would recommend3:05:26to everyone?3:05:27>> I don't like stuff really.3:05:31uh as as as little stuff as few things3:05:35as I can. So3:05:37>> anything it can be shoes, air purifier3:05:41like3:05:43so trivial and irrelevant to life3:05:46>> anything.3:05:47>> So so it's what?3:05:49>> So so since you mentioned the car and I3:05:52I was looking at it in in that way3:05:54because3:05:56it is uh about finding value for3:05:59yourself.3:06:03which is the easy thing is to have it3:06:06from an external3:06:09external source. I used to drive a3:06:11Honda. Now I drive a BMW. So I feel3:06:13better.3:06:15External3:06:16internally.3:06:18What is the value that you get? Uh you3:06:22mentioned my car. So that's my my Polo3:06:24GT which I've been working on and tuning3:06:27for a long time. It's not very3:06:29expensive. And you know, when you count3:06:33what I paid for it brand new and the3:06:36total cost of every bit of work that3:06:38I've ever put into it, it will still3:06:40cost less than like a new, you know,3:06:42Mercedes or BMW.3:06:44It's so dollar amount is less, but for3:06:48me the value is very high. Hm.3:06:51>> Uh so what I recommend for people to buy3:06:56if if if it's your jam, [gasps]3:06:59uh you can buy a throttle controller for3:07:01about 10,000 rupees. Uh throttle3:07:04controller is a small bit of of hardware3:07:09and a little soft which comes with the3:07:11software pre-installed that most cars3:07:15you should be able to plug and play. You3:07:17can plug it in and it allows you to3:07:20adjust how much your uh your intake3:07:23valves open on on your car. If you3:07:25imagine uh tie tie a cloth on your face3:07:29and and go running and then if you open3:07:32the cloth how you can breathe more3:07:35that's kind of what a throttle3:07:36controller will will do on your car.3:07:38When you press the accelerator to see3:07:41slow,3:07:42>> it'll give you little bit more.3:07:45>> And we'll you get this for less than3:07:4610,000.3:07:47>> Yeah, about 10,000 you can get a basic3:07:50entry level throttle controller. And3:07:52it's for any car like3:07:54>> you have to find the correct one for3:07:56your car and not for every car but most3:08:00most modern cars anything sold within3:08:02the last 10 15 years3:08:06polo GT but3:08:10that's why I have that car3:08:13>> because it's a polo it's a small car I3:08:15can park it anywhere you can drive it in3:08:18Bombay if you have a Lambor Lamborghini3:08:21then you can't drive3:08:26It has all the power and all the3:08:28driving.3:08:31I used to have a Ferrari. I couldn't3:08:33have any fun with it. I was always3:08:34stressed driving very slowly down the3:08:36road.3:08:38Where do you park it? With this car, I3:08:40have a lot more fun. Ferrari is real3:08:43speeds3:08:48or and whenever you're driving, you are3:08:49driving very defensively.3:08:53stop.3:08:57You're very stressed that something's3:08:58going to bump it and scratch it. You You3:09:00just can't really3:09:03have fun and enjoy what they are driving3:09:07it in a in a city like Bombay.3:09:10A Supa polo GT you can have lots of fun3:09:12with.3:09:12>> So, which is the best patch to drive in3:09:15Mumbai? Which is your favorite area to3:09:18>> now? The coastal road.3:09:19>> Coastal road. Yeah. Coastal road is is a3:09:22lot of fun.3:09:22>> Yeah.3:09:24>> Always within the speed limit.3:09:27[laughter]3:09:29>> 150. No in India. [snorts]3:09:32140.3:09:35N. [laughter]3:09:38>> Are you a fan of the uh Tokyo Drift?3:09:42>> Yeah. Quite.3:09:43>> It's my favorite fast and3:09:45>> drifting. I'm learning drifting. In3:09:47fact,3:09:49>> uh close circuit in in Pune.3:09:52>> Uh so, uh I've friends with uh Jewi3:09:57who's a3:09:59motorsports just kind of a3:10:02multi-disiplinary motorsports badass.3:10:04He's he races cars, bikes, everything.3:10:08Uh so him Salam Seikko whose uh nickname3:10:13is the drift king.3:10:14>> Yeah. I've been hanging out with these3:10:16boys and kind of uh getting a little a3:10:18little bit seat of seat time and getting3:10:20some instruction just because I wanted3:10:22to learn drift. Yeah. Check this out.3:10:34So cool, dude.3:10:45So this is the guy you mentioned who is3:10:48doing this?3:10:48>> No, that's me.3:10:49>> It's you.3:10:50>> Yeah.3:10:52>> I love the anime girl on this.3:10:55>> That is Yeah. Their car. [laughter]3:10:59>> Let's see. Here's3:11:02this is those two guys. That's Jeet.3:11:06>> Dude,3:11:12this is so cool.3:11:14And now Sonul see this.3:11:28So they do this thing where the two cars3:11:30drift like this and they're like inches3:11:32off. just inches away from each other.3:11:35>> Fast and Furious3:11:38soundtrack.3:11:39So good.3:11:42>> I'm inside with Sam and Je is in that3:11:45car. See how close he gets to the3:11:47>> Yeah,3:11:57>> these guys.3:12:00These guys are pros. Like proper proper3:12:04pros. They can do this thing where the3:12:07cars go like this this way,3:12:09>> you know, which is one of our most viral3:12:12uh YouTube shots of all time. Can you3:12:14open the Kunal Kimu one? I want to show3:12:16you a video.3:12:18>> I've gone through a lot of bikes.3:12:20Currently, I own three.3:12:25One of my favorite bikes was 1250 GS3:12:27BMW.3:12:29That's my prize possession.3:12:40[laughter]3:12:50It was a brilliant bike.3:13:01Foreventure3:13:16[music]3:13:23bikes3:13:30chopper bikes Harley-Davidson3:13:32sports bikes Hayabuza is your that holy3:13:35grail of3:13:36>> of the bike to even if you don't like3:13:38the mechanics of it you just respect the3:13:41bike for what it is3:13:42>> people just loved this I think it has3:13:43some 3 4 million views3:13:46>> it's a biker culture no3:13:48>> so uh do you guys have any questions I3:13:50think I3:13:51>> I want to show another video from this3:13:54is one of our first viral reads and it3:13:56might have something to do with you only3:13:59so dash3:14:10Shashi Kapoor, Shila, Tagur,3:14:26Algeria.3:14:28Algeria.3:14:42>> [music]3:14:45[singing]3:14:50>> Wait,3:14:52>> so that original film was a a hit in3:14:55Algeria.3:14:56>> Crazy. Crazy how sometimes these things3:14:59happen.3:15:00>> Yeah.3:15:02>> Uh this reminds me of So I had this uh3:15:06this incident. This is now 20 years ago3:15:082006. Uh I had gone with my family where3:15:10in uh uh we're in Greece.3:15:15So somewhere where in some restaurant uh3:15:19one uh waitress started talking to us.3:15:21Okay. Where are you people from? SSA we3:15:24are from India saying uh and this girl3:15:28was uh from somewhere in Russia. Russia,3:15:32but somewhere within Russia3:15:35is where she was from. So she says, "Oh,3:15:38you're from India. You know Jimmy."3:15:42And there's there was a pause at the3:15:43table like Jimmy. Jimmy, you know, so3:15:47Jimmy, Jimmy, Jimmy, Aa, Aa, you know3:15:49Jimmy. And all of us froze like, "Wait,3:15:53you mean3:15:55like yes, yes, Disco dancer." Oh,3:15:58>> turns out Disco Dancer was an epic epic3:16:01hit in Russia in the3:16:04'7s.3:16:06Uh whenever3:16:08>> early ' 80s was disco dancer, huh?3:16:10>> So it released there I guess and it was3:16:13a huge like cultural phenomenon.3:16:17So this girl who was uh and who you know3:16:21not of that age uh at that point I was3:16:2522 23 years old something like this she3:16:28must have been you know 28 29 years old3:16:31soi that she was uh had seen it back3:16:34then it had survived culturally they had3:16:37it on I don't know video3:16:41big fan and they're like we we love3:16:43Jimmy and and they they knew Mthuna as3:16:47uh as Jimmy.3:16:47>> So cool. So cool.3:16:49>> It's it's always wild to me when Hindi3:16:52films travel to some far off place.3:16:59>> So any other questions any of you have?3:17:02Anything anyone wants to ask?3:17:04>> Speaking of music, because all your3:17:06films have had very memorable songs. So3:17:09what are like some of your favorite3:17:10songs from your movies?3:17:13>> I tend to go for the deep cuts.3:17:16uh the songs on the album which were not3:17:19so popular to I got super lucky to have3:17:22some really great uh music composers and3:17:25great music albums which is never in3:17:27your hands3:17:30it just happens the directors working3:17:32with the composer and when you're at a3:17:35certain stage of of your career maybe3:17:37you're involved in it I was3:17:40not at a stage in my career where I was3:17:42invited to music sittings3:17:45it just happens that we got such I got3:17:47such great songs uh in in my films3:17:51but I was always into the deep cuts on3:17:53on the Janetu album I was the first one3:17:56to pick out Kahito and say this is my3:17:59favorite track and it wasn't a hit at3:18:02the time of release at the time of3:18:03release3:18:05dance uh even uh Nazir Milana Nazar3:18:10Churana those songs got a lot more3:18:13airplay kahito never got airplay Okay.3:18:15So, it was one of the deep track deep3:18:17cuts hidden in the album. Over time,3:18:19it's built up a following and today it's3:18:22got popularity.3:18:23>> Dude, one underrated song is3:18:28>> I love that song so much.3:18:30>> I like I crack up laughing every like3:18:34there's that line which says3:18:39[laughter]3:18:41I'm like I feel you, man. I like I've3:18:43felt that so many times.3:18:46So Janu is 2000.3:18:50I think I was I think in 8th or 9th3:18:52standard then eth maybe3:18:55even school and it was decided3:18:59performance3:19:01and practice like and I was in Savia's3:19:04Japur. I'm from Japur so school which3:19:07radio but before the cultural leave our3:19:11like uh school's principal father came3:19:13in and he said I want you guys to mute3:19:16the word salah3:19:18and and we like what and then3:19:23[gasps]3:19:26we like [laughter]3:19:29dance3:19:31and we didn't understand3:19:34it's a3:19:35dance.3:19:37>> One one more deep cut of the album3:19:41breakad album.3:19:43>> Uh there's a song which is not in the3:19:46film. Uh so and there is no so there is3:19:48no picturesization of it. There's no3:19:50video. So the only way people would have3:19:52heard it is on the album. Uh song is3:19:55called don't worry about me. It's an3:19:58English song. What happened is actually3:19:59there is a3:20:01uh a song which is in the film called3:20:04Meionga.3:20:06>> So that is a regular song. It is3:20:08picturesized and it's it's in the film.3:20:10H3:20:11>> at some point long after we had finished3:20:14shooting everything uh Vishal and3:20:16Shakhar uh who had done the uh the album3:20:20they were messing around in studio and3:20:23Vishal has started going tank tank tank3:20:24and he has made up some English lyrics3:20:27to sing to the tune of Meionga. So it's3:20:30it's mega but he's playing it kind of3:20:32instrumental3:20:34and he starts singing some English3:20:36lyrics and they did a just a what we3:20:40call a scratch version a katcha3:20:42recording. I happened to drop by the3:20:44studio. I was, you know, hanging out3:20:45with Danish. Uh, and they said, "Hey,3:20:48listen to this." They played it and I3:20:51went, "Oh my god, this is amazing." And3:20:54they're like,3:20:56and obviously this is 2009, 2010.3:20:59There's no place for an English song on3:21:02a Hindi film album. What will you do3:21:04with this? I insisted, I pushed uh they3:21:08had in fact closed the uh the album. It3:21:11had been sent for mastering and to start3:21:13pressing CDs when they know we were3:21:15pressing CDs.3:21:17Uh I called the producer right like stop3:21:20the presses, master this song, add it3:21:22onto the album, please, please. So it3:21:24was like my push and my insistence that3:21:27nudged that song onto the album.3:21:30>> Uh so it's got this little kind of a3:21:31Jack Johnson uh kind of a vibe. It's an3:21:35entirely English song that is an English3:21:37take on a Hindi song in the in the film.3:21:40>> I think Indol shared a song with me that3:21:43you I think really like uh War on Drugs.3:21:46Under pressure.3:21:47>> Under the Pressure.3:21:48>> Under the Pressure. I think it's your3:21:50favorite driving song or something.3:21:52>> One of the favorites. Yeah. This this3:21:54band I'm a big fan of.3:21:55>> Yeah.3:21:56>> Uh because it's it's a very throwback3:21:59style of music. M3:22:01>> uh it's they're they're they're uh not3:22:06afraid of doing long songs. Like here is3:22:08an 11 minute song and there's a 2 and3:22:111/2 minute guitar solo in the middle.3:22:13>> Yeah.3:22:16>> That kind of musical indulgence. Now3:22:18it's you know two 2 and 1/2 minutes uh3:22:22hook chorus hook chorus. Yes.3:22:24>> So this was amazing. Thank you so much3:22:26Iran Maz.3:22:29And uh was it as much fun for you as3:22:31>> It's always fun nerding out on on3:22:34>> You get to do this often on the3:22:36>> I I have uh two friends who are uh uh3:22:41who who enjoy the the deep dives that I3:22:44do. So I I have two people who I can3:22:46call up every so often and say, "Hey,3:22:48listen. I found a new rabbit hole."3:22:50>> But I think on the cameras on a podcast,3:22:52you're doing it for the first time.3:22:54>> Yeah. In an actual authentic way. Yeah.3:22:57I've in in passing mentioned little bits3:23:00here and there because that these are my3:23:03interests and passions.3:23:09>> We need to give the audience a hashtag3:23:12that if you have watched the episode3:23:13till here use this hashtag. So what3:23:16should be the hashtag that people should3:23:18use in the comments?3:23:20>> # Tokyo Drift.3:23:22>> Let's go. Let's go. Let's go.3:23:26>> [laughter]3:23:27>> # Tokyo # Tokyo Drift.3:23:31So guys3:23:34of longest interview season 4 and I am3:23:38so proud of this episode. Imran is such3:23:40a great person like3:23:46and I'll keep consuming everything he3:23:48recommended. Now I quickly want to give3:23:49a shout out to all the brands who are a3:23:52part of longest interview season 4.3:23:55District the ticketing platform which I3:23:58use myself for booking movie tickets for3:24:00booking event tickets. Find the best3:24:02seats only on District. See you at the3:24:05movies. I also want to thank Audible.3:24:07Season 4 of Longest Interview is in3:24:09association with Audible. They have been3:24:10our long-term partners. Audible is an3:24:12app I have been using for years to3:24:14consume books or this episode3:24:17recommendations3:24:19mostly.3:24:22So go and like check those out.3:24:24Audiobooks has like changed my game when3:24:26it comes to book consumption and it can3:24:28do the same for you. You can get Audible3:24:30free for 2 months if you click on the3:24:32link in description. And I also want to3:24:33thank Simba who are our roaring partners3:24:35for this season. [music] So yes, this3:24:37was the first episode of the season #3:24:39Tokyo Zar3:24:42episode and I'll be back soon with3:24:45another episode of Longest Interview3:24:47soon on Chaletra Talks. [music]
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