Transcript of How Pixar’s Animation MISTAKE Created This Iconic Scene | Pete Docter
High Performance Business
0:00Everybody, I'm Pete Docter. I directed0:02Monsters Inc, Up, Inside Out, and Soul,0:04[music] and I'm now Chief Creative0:06Officer at Pixar Animation Studios.0:09Yeah, it was at a time when animation,0:12at least in my sphere, had been very,0:14[music]0:15maybe marginalized is the wrong word,0:16but there were traditions that, you0:18know, every everyone was a musical, they0:20were always [music] kind of generally0:21about princesses and, you know, fairy0:24tales, and so we thought man, animation0:27could do anything. Let's do something0:28different with it. Let's explore [music]0:30stories that are set in our world, but0:33maybe, you know, from a different0:34perspective. We'll lower the camera. A0:36few of those choices just made the whole0:38thing come to life. I mean, I remember0:40thinking my toys [music] had a secret0:43life that as soon as I left they would0:45all get together and discuss [music]0:46stuff, and so it kind of kind of was0:49second nature to to bring that0:52to life because it was so much a part of0:54all of our imagination, I think. None of0:56us knew what we were doing.0:58And so, looking back there was this1:00freedom,1:02a sense [music] that there was no rule1:04book, because we, I mean, we desperately1:07wanted rule books. We were looking back1:08at the way Walt Disney made films1:11[music] and the way the folks at Disney1:13at the time were making movies. That was1:14kind of our own only um a measurement as1:17to whether we were doing this at all1:19right, but a lot of it was just [music]1:21make it up as we went. And it was a fun1:23group of people.1:24We I would routinely stay till [music]1:27midnight, 1:00 in the morning animating1:29because1:30um it was just such a thrill.1:34Yeah, it's come a long way. I mean,1:36there were a lot of restrictions. I1:37mean, John Lasseter, the director of Toy1:39Story, his approach was1:41I remember him specifically saying,1:42"Don't worry about what's possible,1:44what's hard. Just let's create what we1:46want conceptually, [music] so through1:48writing or drawing, and then when we get1:50to make it, we deal with that1:53challenge." We had a Oh, I remember on1:55the first film, Woody has been burned1:57[music] with a magnifying glass with1:59Sid, and as soon as Sid leaves, he2:01The original thought was he would go2:03douse his head in this bowl of what2:05ended up being water from the [music]2:07dog. So, it'd have goo flowing in there,2:09and you know, that was very difficult.2:11Water was [music] near impossible. So,2:13if you remember in the film, what we did2:15was we staged it low, and it was like a2:17bowl of old2:19cereal that he dunked [music] his head2:20in. So, we came up with clever ways of2:22dealing with the restrictions of the2:24technology. Now,2:26>> [music]2:27>> I don't think there is really anything2:28that we couldn't do. Not to say it's2:30cheap or easy, um but really it's more2:33of like how is this artist going to2:35bring this [music] idea to life in a way2:38that2:39hooks into people. It's more about that2:41than the limitations of the technology.2:44So, you've [music] got much more2:45freedom, basically, with what you're2:47creating. Yeah, which can be dangerous.2:49>> [laughter]2:53>> Steve uh was pretty brilliant, [music]2:55obviously. Remember one, we had a2:57meeting about2:58some toy problem, and he he came late,3:01and he just listened, [music]3:03and very quickly cut through like we3:05were all talking about this, and he's3:07like,3:08"The real problem [music] is this." He3:10was able to analyze and understand the3:12root issue. Pretty brilliant. Also, in3:16our [music]3:17experience at Pixar, very humble. I know3:19that's not the way he always came off at3:21Apple and other places, but [music] he3:22would say, "Look, you guys are the3:23experts. I just watched this movie.3:26Don't I'm not going to tell you what to3:27do." However, and then he would have two3:29brilliant notes that were very [music]3:31insightful. And my wife said, "Do you3:33think if anybody ever asked Steve to go3:34to lunch?" And like, "I don't know, man.3:36I'll try." So, I asked him to lunch, and3:38he said, "Yes." So, I I got to have3:40lunch with him several times one-on-one.3:43I do think he was a guy [music] who just3:45felt like the priority is what I'm doing3:48here.3:49If I hurt your feelings or whatever,3:51[music] that's too bad. I care most3:53deeply about this thing being great.3:56Um and that is uh rare. You know, most3:58of us are so [music] caught up in the4:00social dynamics of things. I don't want4:02to upset somebody. I you know, um so4:04there's a lot at play, but he somehow4:06was [music] able to reduce down to like4:08this is the the single most important4:10thing we need to which is amazing as a4:12leader.4:14Well, we didn't set out to do this. This4:16was really born out of laziness. When4:18you make a movie in the computer, you4:19can't [music] just grab a lamp or go to4:21the thrift store and roll a rug out. You4:23have to build everything. [music]4:24So, as we were trying to fill this set,4:26we're like, well, just grab that from4:28this other movie and put that [music] in4:29there. Um Monsters, we uh needed a toy4:32that Sulley would [music] give the Boo4:34could show to to Sulley. And so, we just4:37took um Nemo, the fish, which hadn't4:40come out yet. And it was really just us4:42kind of being like, well, we need4:43something. [music] Um and then it4:45developed into this whole thing where4:47there's checklists and people tracking4:49it and trying to disguise them more and4:51more.4:52>> [music]4:52>> Uh there are I man, I don't know that4:54there's anything that people haven't4:55discovered. They're they're all over the4:57place and very insidious, you know,4:59background posters and5:00>> [music]5:00>> remodeled. I know um the Pizza Planet5:02truck has shown up in a lot of different5:05forms cuz like Up, the style was such5:08that everything was [music] very5:09caricatured and boxy. And so, we had we5:11couldn't just put the Pizza Planet truck5:13in there. It would look like it's from a5:14different universe. So, [music] we5:15rebuilt it to to fit there. Yeah, we we5:18do go through a lot of [music]5:20uh hoops to get it to work.5:24Uh I was lucky enough to know this guy5:25Joe Grant. [music] He actually came up5:27with the story for Dumbo and picked5:29songs for Fantasia. And5:31he in his old age would say, "Well, all5:33ideas are brilliant until you have to5:35tell them to someone else."5:36>> [music]5:36>> Which is absolutely true. They seem5:38great and then you make them and you're5:39like, "Oh, why didn't that They didn't5:41laugh or cry. I thought that I thought5:43it was going to work." Um5:44>> [music]5:44>> and there's the old adage, "Writing is5:46rewriting." I think that's a huge part5:48of it is very few exceptions. [music]5:51You can5:52you know, there's people like G.K.5:53Chesterton who would just dictate the5:56whole thing and that was the book. But5:58for most mortals, you write it [music]6:00and then it's wrong and you rewrite it6:02and you rewrite it. All the Pixar movies6:04that you see6:05>> [music]6:05>> have been rewritten at least eight times6:08by the time you see it.6:11Yeah, it shifts as we go, but you know,6:13generally at least so far we've [music]6:14been on people rather than ideas.6:16Whereas in Hollywood you might say6:18the the studio buys the [music] script6:20and says you were going to you're going6:21to direct this. We generally say you6:24[music] go develop some ideas. And so an6:27artist will sit hopefully with a few6:29friends and fill a room with ideas just6:32um6:33things that they're interested in6:35concepts. I remember Dan Scanlon would6:38just think about different aspects of6:40his own life, um pin all these things up6:42and out of that comes generally three or6:44four ideas [music] that then they will6:46pitch to other people, um myself6:48included and then we just look around6:50and go like are any of these really6:52compelling and inspiring and I want to6:54hear more and that's really the only6:55[music] criteria. It's not like it has6:57a checklist of things it has to meet.6:59It's just like7:00this one is interesting. I want to let's7:02let's let's explore that some more.7:06Where a movie for me really comes to7:07life is in the editing room. So we'll7:10have written a script, we'll have had7:11artists draw all these almost like comic7:13books versions stills of the movie7:16>> [music]7:16>> and we'll cut it together with dialogue7:18that we just do ourselves and music and7:20sound effects and we'll watch these7:22scenes. This is all before it's7:23animated. So it's like a a dummy mock-up7:25version of the movie. [music] Animatic I7:27guess most people call um and that's7:30where so much either lives or dies. I7:33might think it looks brilliant on the7:35page, but then I see it and I'm like7:37this is I don't believe it. I don't I'm7:39not I'm not into this. I don't [music]7:40understand why and then you have to7:41diagnose and rip it apart and put it7:43back together. And that's the exciting7:45part. That's like the real writer's7:46room, I think.7:50Attitude.7:52Uh goal. And if a character doesn't have7:54something [music] they want, you're dead7:55in the water. Um and relatability. And7:59that doesn't necessarily This is a8:00flaw we fall into often is8:03>> [music]8:03>> Andrew Stanton calls it bland8:04protagonist disease that, you know,8:06because they're the main character, you8:08want them to [music] be nice and good8:10and approachable. And you know, there's8:12so many examples in cinema history where8:14really despicable [music]8:16things being done by the main character,8:18but somehow you find the vulnerability8:20in there [music]8:21that makes the audience go, "Oh, I I'm8:23I'm with them. I know they just murdered8:25[music] somebody, but I'm with them. I8:27understand them. I feel what they feel."8:29And I think that's always the big key is8:31the vulnerability. Um finding We had uh8:35uh making Inside Out. We were on8:37screening [music] five or six, so we'd8:38been at this for three and a half, four8:41years, and people would watch what we8:42had and say, "I love this concept. I8:45hate your main character. So, I don't8:47really8:47>> [music]8:47>> root for your movie." And Joy, who is8:50all sweetness and light, just got8:53grating. So, we had to find moments to8:56show [music] her vulnerability. We had8:57to show moments where she would kind of9:00melt and feel bad for her kid and uh9:03[music] feel as though she's defeated. I9:05think that's something that is probably9:08true of real life, too. We all try9:09[music] to present, you know, our strong9:11self. We've got it all together and I'm9:13And then you know, you think of your9:14friends that are really close, they're9:16usually people that you've gone [music]9:17through some sort of hardship or you've9:19recognized, "Oh, they've9:21suffered divorce or loss of some sort."9:23And that's what really [music] connects9:24you, I think.9:27It's a little bit like Pixar itself.9:28Pixar was founded uh at the intersection9:31of art and technology. [music] So, when9:34it was started, to even turn on a9:36computer, you would have a computer9:37[music] science degree. So, we had these9:39brilliant PhDs and then artists who knew9:42nothing about computers, but could draw9:44[music] and visualize thing and we were9:46both working towards the same thing.9:48Inside Out, we as artists again are are9:51>> [music]9:51>> uh9:52observing the world just in a in a very9:54instinctive basis and trying to capture9:56it in our art. Um we also then met9:59[music] with these uh scientists like uh10:02Dacher Keltner and and um Paul Ekman10:05>> [music]10:05>> people who have made a study of human10:07emotion. And they were able to break10:09down a lot of things that we hadn't10:10observed as artists [music]10:11and vice versa. So, you know, you end up10:14a film like Inside Out it would not10:16[music] have be the same were it not for10:18those scientists who really brought so10:21much to the fore. You know, it it even10:23thinking about like anger, you know, I10:25think at the time I thought, "Well,10:27anger is just kind of something that10:28[music] gets you in trouble um when you10:30road rage or something like this." And10:31then when you read and really analyze,10:34"No, anger is about10:35protecting you from getting ripped off10:37basically. [music] When you feel like10:39you've been wronged or taken advantage10:41of in some way." And that then gave us a10:43whole script for what anger is all10:46about. What kind [music] of words does10:47he use? What are his motivations and10:50triggers? So, you know, each character10:52you go down the the row of all these10:53emotions, we learned so much from uh10:56working with these scientists [music]10:58that made it onto the screen. In today's11:00world, reliability is everything. And11:02that's why IFS.ai11:05is designed to help mission-critical11:06industries run with confidence. By11:09embedding AI across core operations,11:11businesses can reduce downtime, boost11:13productivity, and make smarter decisions11:16whether it's asset management, service11:18delivery, or product execution. If11:20you're ready to work smarter, not11:23harder, discover how IFS.ai is11:26redefining performance at IFS. ai11:32I I think, you know, like with anything,11:35the actual secret [music] is not one11:36thing, it's multiple things. For one, we11:38had amazing origins [music]11:40of, you know, between Ed Catmull, who11:42was a brilliant scientist, Steve Jobs, a11:45brilliant pioneer and entrepreneur11:47[music] who was able to protect us and11:49get certain things, fight against, you11:51know, systems and whatnot, and John11:53Lasseter, who was a a brilliant creative11:55mind. You know, everyone kind of came11:58together at the right time. And then,12:00you know, we had success, which12:02doesn't happen often, and then we were12:05able to repeat it, which doesn't [music]12:06happen often. That's that I remember12:08Steve Jobs saying he was most worried12:10about our second film because, yeah, you12:13can make one, but [music] how do you12:14prove that you're not just like a12:16one-and-done. So, um we've now had 30.12:20Only one or two have not really12:22delivered12:23at the box office. So, [music] wow, I12:26don't really know exactly how to12:29explain all that other than we have12:30amazing people we get to work with and12:32and we're very12:34fortunate.12:35>> [laughter]12:37>> Well, I mean, Andrew Stanton12:39>> [music]12:39>> is12:41brilliant.12:42He is a tough guy. He's not somebody who12:46will [music] just say, "That's12:47wonderful." and pat you on the head.12:48He's going to fight you on stuff, which12:50is really helpful. He's [music] made12:52every film we've worked on better. He's12:55a brilliant writer and he's just [music]12:56not satisfied. He's always kind of12:58pushing to make things better.13:01I would I would say [music] he's been13:03probably the most impactful.13:05>> [snorts]13:06>> Yeah, like all of them, you know.13:08Well, okay, there's been a few like Carl13:11Fredricksen working with Ed Asner. He13:13That He Well, even there, there were13:15things we learned from him as an actor13:17that we would go back and change in the13:18writing.13:19>> [music]13:19>> Um13:20you know, Joy was huge. Amy understood13:24very quickly [music]13:25what she could do with that character,13:27Um, and that changed a ton. Woody, I13:29think probably the biggest is maybe um,13:32Buzz.13:33So, when we first wrote him, I was doing13:35the scratch [music] dialogue, that sort13:36of temporary dialogue, and we were doing13:38it sort of like a Dudley Do-Right, like,13:41"I'll save you. Stand back. Stop." You13:44know, that kind of [music] stuff. And we13:45were expecting Tim Allen would do that,13:47too. And he didn't. He kind of came in13:49more with a swagger.13:50>> [music]13:50>> And I remember Andrew Stanton and I13:52looking at each other and going, "This13:54is a disaster. This isn't going to13:56work." But of course what it made us do13:58is to reconceive [music]13:59that character much less arch and14:01stereotype and more specific. [music]14:03And um,14:05he just grew into the Buzz Lightyear14:06that we know. He's like a space [music]14:08cop a little bit more than than the way14:10we were seeing him.14:12>> [snorts]14:13>> Well, it may not be obvious to to14:15[music] people watching the movie, Sully14:16is a monster who loves his job. He comes14:19to work. He's all about practicing and14:21working out. And then he's [music] gets14:23stuck with this kid and it's immediately14:25frightening and scary. But he eventually14:27just falls in love with this kid to the14:29point where now he's ready to risk his14:31whole career.14:33Uh, that was me as an animator. I loved14:35this I was waking up and falling asleep14:38all about animation. Then my wife and I14:40had our first child and suddenly you're14:42like, "I I'm responsible for this living14:44being. Oh my goodness." And then um,14:46being so interested [music] and14:48compelled, I suddenly felt split. Like,14:51maybe I don't want to go to work. Maybe14:52I want to stay home and watch this14:54>> [music]14:54>> living being sitting up for the first14:57time. So, you know, I didn't plan to14:59make a film like [music] that. But I15:02think like most of the movies we've15:03made, your real life seeps up [music]15:06and into it and your experience as a15:08human15:10uh, come out through cars or insects or15:12[music] toys or whatever. I think that's15:14one of the joys of watching of making15:16the movies for sure, but then watching15:18them to to hopefully the audience is15:20going like, "Oh yeah, I I recognize that15:22as real, you know."15:25Well, um15:26Asterix, yes. It was actually a number15:29of lunches. We had [music] um15:31this We didn't have our own cafe at when15:34Pixar was in Point Richmond. We'd go to15:36this little uh restaurant called Hidden15:37[music] City and we'd sit and they had15:40uh you know a lot of a lot of times15:41restaurants will roll paper out on the15:43top and [music] we just sit and draw as15:45we're talking cuz that's you keep your15:47hand busy. [music]15:49And um yeah, I remember a lot of those15:51ideas being floated around there.15:53>> [music]15:53>> Um15:54um of course, ideas, you know, it's been15:57described like whistling on the stairs15:59of Carnegie Hall. Like to get an idea to16:01make it a real [music] thing, that's16:03where the real work lies.16:05Um and that's what happened after that16:07meal.16:08>> [laughter]16:10>> Well, uh Star Wars, believe it or not,16:13it's not on my top 10. However, at16:16Pixar, [music] I think there's not a day16:17goes by without some reference to it.16:20It's, you know, structurally so16:21brilliant and very immersive and there's16:24just so [music] much that that film has16:25brought. Um let's see, I'm trying to16:27think of other ones. Goodfellas is16:28another one that comes up [music] a lot.16:31Again,16:32it's [clears throat] very admirable. I16:33love it.16:36Yeah, well, I've definitely thought of16:37it in relation to animation. Animators16:39are, like everybody, in need of human16:41companionship, connection. [music]16:43But um16:45historically, anyway, we're much more16:47kind of uh awkward socially and so it's16:50easy like for me, it was a lot easier to16:51draw someone than to talk to them cuz16:53that's very scary.16:54>> [music]16:54>> Um but we get to perform, we get to be16:57on stage without having to do it16:59ourselves. So, we can draw, we can17:01create [music] these characters that do17:03all the things we want to do, but we17:05don't have to. So, I do think there is17:07something about that [music] need to be17:09seen um and yet the push-pull of like17:13I'm too scared to do [music] that. Um17:15yeah, for sure.17:19Do it.17:20I think most people think, "Oh, if I17:21read all these books and I [music]17:23study, then I'll have all the17:25information, then I'll be able to do17:26this brilliant thing."17:28You don't know anything until you try to17:30do it yourself, and then [music] it will17:31be wrong, so expect that. Do it,17:35be wrong,17:36forgive yourself, move forward, do it17:38again.17:39>> [music]17:39>> Um, you know, every one of the movies17:40we've made, uh, by the time you see it,17:42there's dozens of versions of attempts,17:45some things that [music] didn't play.17:47Um, and I think having some way to,17:50>> [music]17:51>> um,17:51what's the word? Mock up what you're17:53doing, to show it to other people, to17:55kind of experience it objectively,17:57um, there's no substitute for that.18:01I think what happens is, you know, at18:03the beginning we were just trying to18:04tell funny stories that [music] are18:06compelling and engaging, and then what18:08we found was people really praised us18:11for the scenes18:12>> [music]18:12>> where they were pulled in emotionally.18:14Um, or they would come out pontificating18:16about something18:17>> [music]18:17>> that we were like sort of loosely hoping18:20people would get. Um, and then at times18:23we find ourselves18:24uh, overdoing that, you know, that the18:26films have to18:27>> [music]18:27>> have some meaning and they need to say18:29something. I think, to me, I guess,18:32where I've come to, it's a little like18:34you want it to be candy on the outer18:35surface. It's got to be [music] bright18:37and shiny and fun. And then when you get18:38down in the middle, maybe there's some18:40meat, you know, some stuff that you're18:41you would take home with you. Um,18:43[music]18:44but it can't be it can't be vegetables18:47on the outside.18:48It has to be candy.18:51Yeah, well, Hoppers, uh, we're very18:53excited about it. It's directed by18:54Daniel Chong, who [music] is a18:56storyboard artist on Inside Out. He, uh,18:59uh, put together this brilliant movie of19:01this girl who discovers she can hop into19:03the body of a robot beaver, and maybe19:06hopefully save this glade, this this19:08area, an environment that she's very19:09fond of, only to discover19:12that the animals are secretly [music]19:13plotting to overthrow humans. So, it's a19:15it's a bit of a uh like a thriller. It's19:18it's [music] bonkers. It's crazy. Uh and19:20there's just so much fun stuff in it. Uh19:22Toy Story 5 is about [music]19:25all of the gang from Toy Story films, of19:27course, but now it's toys meet tech,19:30right? Just [music] like real life, kids19:32aren't sitting on the ground playing19:33with dolls all the time. They're on19:35screens. And what does that mean now19:37when you're a toy? So, it's uh it's very19:41uh timely and [music] um19:43real-life.19:46It's funny thinking back to when Toy19:47Story came out,19:48>> [music]19:49>> I would get this question from every19:50journalist, "How long until computers19:52replace all actors?"19:54And that was the fear even back then19:56that somehow this new burgeoning19:57technology of CG would replace20:00something. Of course, that hasn't20:01[music] happened because I think we as20:03humans want to watch and relate to other20:06humans. And AI, I think, will be a20:08[music] great tool for that. For the20:10creative process, it'll aid people who20:12are creative. I think you know, it'll20:14make it I mean, if I'm if my mom can sit20:17and generate some beautiful image based20:19on [music] texts, I think what's going20:21to make them really more valuable are20:23people who are creative, who understand20:25how to tell a story. [music]20:27You know, that's always going to be20:28important. That's always going to be the20:30the real value of this.
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